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Author Topic: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)  (Read 3636 times)

Offline Bob_Roller

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Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« on: March 20, 2015, 11:50:29 AM »
Has anyone here have any experience with Amsoil  synthetic oil products for motorcycles ???

My lead mechanic at work sell these products, motorcycle oil 20w40, for around $8.00US per quart .
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Offline Barry

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2015, 12:32:55 PM »
There is one Amsoil product in this test and it does extremely well, beaten only by racing oils. BTW This test is one of the best I've ever seen and puts to bed once and for all the simplistic obsession with ZDDP alone as the sole indicator of oil quality. I've been saying that for years and I don't know what I'm talking about. Well this guy does. The results also put to bed the notion that you can outsmart the oil companies by adding your own ZDDP.
http://speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=35836
« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 12:33:40 PM by bhodgson »
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline marcmax

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #2 on: March 20, 2015, 12:49:14 PM »
I have been using Amsoil synthetic oil in my K75s for about six years now. I am not hard on the engine and change it regularly and have never had an incident that could be related to the oil. I also have no evidence that it is any better that semi synthetic or dino oil, just more expensive. I do use an extended mileage change schedule and haven't seen anything wrong.

I started using Amsoil at the recommendation of my local independent BMW shop.
Keep your bike in good repair: motorcycle boots are not comfortable for walking.

1982 R65ls    1984 R65ls

Offline Ed Miller

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #3 on: March 20, 2015, 03:27:03 PM »
Hey Barry, that OP of the thread to which you linked was sure getting some negative feedback though.  

I have used AMSOIL in my motorcycles and cars (pickup leaks oil, so I don't use it in that) for a long time but that doesn't mean anything.  8 bucks a quart is a good deal.  Are you sure he's not selling their 20W50 though, not 20W40?  The 20W50 is aimed at air cooled V twin motorcycle engines.  Close enough for me I guess.

I used to run AMSOIL for 15 - 20,000 miles in my CRX and had the used oil tested by a mail order company.  Blackburn?  Blackstone?  Something like that.  The oil was always OK except the first time when it had high silicon levels due to a K & N air filter.  I went back to stock Honda air filters and it was cleaner after that.  I changed the oil filters every 5,000 miles so had to top up with new oil each time.
Ed Miller
'81 r65
Falls City, OR

Offline Barry

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #4 on: March 20, 2015, 04:06:49 PM »
Quote
Hey Barry, that OP of the thread to which you linked was sure getting some negative feedback though.
 


True, they gave him a hard time didn't they but they were hardly taking the subject seriously and all the detractors had ZDDP tunnel vision while he had actual test results based on the wear that each oil produced.  I loved this bit  -

And some oils are simply better than others, no matter what their zinc levels are. Anyone would have to be delusional to think otherwise

It's so obviously true otherwise you could add lots of ZDDP to any old crappy base stock and produce good oil.  The test results bore that out as when they did add extra ZDDP to run of the mill oil it actually made it worse.
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline Bob_Roller

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #5 on: March 20, 2015, 06:27:27 PM »
The 20w40 is a new oil they just started selling recently .
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Offline MrRiden

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #6 on: March 20, 2015, 07:58:49 PM »
A pal was a distributor back in the 80's. By selling, it kept him in oil for his racing bikes, a Honda 400-4 and Suzuki 1000. Can't really attest to it as we tore the engines down after each weekend of club racing. If you are having trouble sleeping you can find chemical analysis of various oils and compare them here. Amsoil is among them.  http://www.pqiamerica.com/


"We can't stop here. This is bat country".

Offline Ed Miller

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2015, 03:58:39 PM »
Quote
The 20w40 is a new oil they just started selling recently .

Oh.  I would have to check my owner's manual to see how high of temps that weight would work for.  It would probably be better for my area than yours.  The book says I can use 20W50 down to about 17 degrees F., which I actually ride in.  But my morning commute starts out downhill, then slow for a couple of miles, so I'm not winding it up fast.  
Ed Miller
'81 r65
Falls City, OR

wa1udg

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #8 on: April 21, 2015, 07:53:40 PM »
The place for oil talk is "Bob is the oil guy" which can be Googled as BITOG.  The bike oil section of comments is not bad.  Lots of people suggest  Rotella T6 in 5W 40.  Wally world has it for 20 bucks a gallon.  The stuff is a diesel oil also rated for bikes and cars.  Pretty stout stuff. They also have 15 w 40 and a semi synthetic in 10 w 30.  I've been using it in everything from a generator to my cars as well as the '65 and my son's Nighthawk which he puts a lot of miles on.  SHortly it will be going in a 633CSI my son picked up.  

wa1udg

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #9 on: April 21, 2015, 08:11:08 PM »
T6 carries the JASO MA rating for motorcycles.  Up here in the frozen north  a 40 synthetic is all that's really needed.  If I were in the Southwest I'd still trust it myself because of the higher protefction of a full synthetic but reasonable men could disagree on not using a 50.  Mobil makes a 15 w 50 full synthetic now as I recall, but Wallyworld  doesn't carry it around here.  I wouldn't suggest T6 in lieu of the road tar Howley & Davidson requires in their crankcases.
The 5W rating means you don't punish  the battery or starter on cold days.  During a bad storm I started my 5 KW generator with one pull after it sat  out all night in 4 degree weather.  
« Last Edit: April 21, 2015, 08:21:11 PM by wa1udg »

Offline D Mann

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2015, 08:12:07 AM »
I think Amsoil now has and oil with ZDDP the ad I saw was slanted to the 60's muscle car guys. I am thinking about trying it when I use up the Spectro I have on hand.
David Mann
1981 R65
ABC #14407

Offline Semper Gumby

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #11 on: April 28, 2015, 01:44:19 AM »
Castrol has a 5W50 synthetic that is for older cars.  I think this would be fine for bikes that didn't have wet clutches.
Bill Gould ?1980/03 R65 When at first you don't succeed....Moo!

Offline Tony Smith

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #12 on: May 11, 2015, 08:05:19 PM »
Quote
Castrol has a 5W50 synthetic that is for older cars.  I think this would be fine for bikes that didn't have wet clutches.

To throw another curve into this discussion, not necessarily so.

Is the oil in question tested to be stable at the higher temps found in air-cooled engines? Also, is the "detergent package" (a non-scientific term I have just invented to cover the additive chemicals put in oil for specific purposes - the relevance of which will be clearer in the next paragraph) appropriate to an air-cooled flat twin?

Some years ago I bought a grey-market import Toyota Surf (turbo diesel Hilux to English and "Tundra" (I think)  to US readers. The engine package (2L-T) was semi unknown in Australia - the L series diesel engine (sub-port injection, dry liners) was well known as it was fitted to Toyota and Hino vehicles since 1968, but the 2L-T threw in the curve balls of 1st generation electronic injection control (a crock of Sh!t guaranteed to use more fuel than an aneroid controlled injection system) and a turbocharger that gave a slug of an old diesel in a light truck the "get up and go" to stay with passenger sedans in traffic and the ability to cruise at highly illegal speeds on the highway.

Anyway the Australian arm of Toyota decided that it would offer no assistance to owners of grey-market import Toyotas so user groups (in some ways similar to this one) sprang up to share information and expertise. As you can imagine one of the first matters that cropped up was "what oil do I use"?
 
Because of the way I am wired up I contacted Shell, Castrol and Valvolene and asked them, they contacted their overseas branches and I was quickly told by Shell to use 15W40 Rotella, by castrol to use 15W/40 "Delo" diesel oil and by Valvolene to use either the mineral or synthetic versions of their 15W40 diesel oils (interestingly Valvolene told me to use Castrol Dexron III for the auto box and transfer case in opposition to their own supposedly Dexron III equivalent trans fluid, but would not tell me why.
 
Anyway I ended up in a huge argument with a chap who was convinced that Mobil 1 was the perfect oil for the 2L-T engine because his brother's wife's 2nd cousin, who once swept the floor at the Mobil refinery said that he once overheard a conversation that might have indicated that this was the right oil for turbo diesel engines.

His principal argument on the topic of the superior performance of Mobil 1 in 2L-T engines was that when he changed his oil, the old oil came out just as clean as when it went in.

I responded that the 2L engine was well known in the trade as a "dirty diesel" and that it needed high detergent oil with a sophisticated additive package so that it could clean carbon and combustion byproducts out of the internals of the engine and then carry them until the next oil change. I ventured to suggest that the fact that the oil dropped from my engine was as black as the dark side of the moon was an indication that the oil was doing its job and that if his was coming out clean then it was not capable of doing the job.

As can only happen in internet forums facts and logic became the first casualties of a one-sided war in which I was the enemy who knew nothing about oils. (Not that I had ever claimed to know anything, I was simply smart enough to write to oil manufactures and ask them what they thought)
 
Interestingly I am still driving my Surf as the thing simply refuses to die and I can't work up the interest necessary to replace it. My "opponent" on the other hand was the instigator of a lengthy thread a couple of years later on the topic of obtaining a referral to a good but cheap engine rebuilder as his Surf's engine had blown up. As this had happened to a number of other forum members and that the cause had been isolated to the use of incorrect oil, someone suggested that his beloved Mobil 1 might have been responsible. That suggestion was not well received....

The point of this is to gently suggest that there is more to be considered than just the weight of the oil to be used and that either the manufacturer of the engine, or oil companies should be asked to recommend (in writing) the oil they think should be used.

1978 R100RS| 1981 R100RS (JPS) | 1984 R65 | 1992 KLE500 | 2002 R1150GSA |

Offline Ed Miller

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #13 on: May 12, 2015, 01:23:04 PM »
What year is that Surf?  I guess my '81 4WD with the 22R motor would be a Hilux in the rest of the world.  

Ed Miller
'81 r65
Falls City, OR

Offline Tony Smith

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Re: Amsoil ( Dreaded Oil Thread !!!)
« Reply #14 on: May 12, 2015, 09:52:19 PM »
Quote
What year is that Surf?  I guess my '81 4WD with the 22R motor would be a Hilux in the rest of the world.  


1995 Japan model year,  its Toyota vehicle base classification is LN130.
1978 R100RS| 1981 R100RS (JPS) | 1984 R65 | 1992 KLE500 | 2002 R1150GSA |