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Author Topic: Electric Bugs  (Read 3901 times)

Yikes

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Electric Bugs
« on: January 10, 2008, 10:28:29 AM »
A week or so ago, I removed a bolted on starter switch on my new 82 and replaced it with a good used BMW replacement.  The old Frankenstein switch was wired (with brown lamp cord) to a starter terminal and spliced into a switched power wire in the harness nearby.  It worked great but was so offset from the throttle it made giving it gas with the starter button pushed was a two-hand operation.  It also looked ridiculous
Anyway, I removed the old right combo switch assembly and replaced it with the used one –plugged right in to the socket and mounted on the handlebar with one screw – so easy, perhaps too easy.  Ever since then, I’ve had some lack of consistent operation with the starter relay.  When the trouble first happened, the afternoon I replaced the switch, I took off the tank and looked at the relays.  I found by listening which relay was not always cooperating, and found I could coax it to work by tapping on it.  Although I have become very good at popping the tank off and on in under a minute, I decided that I really wanted to get it working without having to remove the tank and tap the relay every time I needed to start.  (You get strange looks from passers by when you do that on the street in the city.)  While pulling the relay out to investigate it further, I accidentally pulled the relay cover off, exposing the inner workings.  I reconnected the battery ground strap and to see what happened when I pushed the starter switch.  I could see the electromagnet was pulling the copper relay contact arm as the button was pushed, but contact was not being made at the point.  If I pushed on the copper arm with my finger, it did contact and the starter engaged just fine.  So I pulled the naked relay out and brightened up the contact point with a little fine sandpaper, reinstalled the relay and cover and it worked OK.  Unfortunately, I could not get it to start yesterday morning and was forced to drive my car to work, missing a rare70-degree January day of quality cycling time.  When I got home I got back into the relay and saw the same thing -action but no contact- so I slightly bent the metal tab carrying the lower contact point to reduce the distance the arm would need to swing to make contact.  Seems to work OK now, but we’ll see over time.  There was also some hesitation on the part of the turn signal relay to work consistently when I first did the switch replacement, but that problem seems to have disappeared.  
One the other thing.  Ever since I replaced the switch, the neutral indicator light comes on every time I pull in the clutch lever.  I am clueless on that and have done nothing to investigate that or fix it.  There have been no problems with the engine once it gets started (provided I remember to turn the fuel petcock on, something I forget to do with embarrassing regularity).
For information, I did disconnect the battery ground strap when I did the switch replacement.  I did not use electric contact cleaner or dielectric grease on the socket connecting the switch cable to the harness on the frame.  I also did not check the wiring in the used replacement BMW switch.  
Anybody have a similar experience or advice for a baffled newbie?  Is a new starter relay in my near future?  The existing one appears to have a 9/81 date on it, so if I did have to replace it, 26-plus years of service would not be too shabby.  Is the neutral indicator light a foreshadowing of future learning experiences and more opportunities for me to get intimate with the bike?  

Online Bob_Roller

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Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2008, 10:44:23 AM »
I had the same problem on my '81 R65 back in -'82 or '83, the relay clicked but did not make electrical contact.

I did the same repair as you did, and the relay lasted until 2002.

Your neutral light coming on when you pull the clutch in, it is also a problem with the starter relay, there is a small diode in there, looks like a black resistor, if you are decent at soldering, you can replace it, I did with a diode from Radio Shack, the number was 1N4001, but any similar small diode will do the job.

Or you could just replace the relay itself, your call !

I don't know what a dealer would charge, but Motorrad Elektrik has the starter relay for $20 plus shipping, may want to try NAPA auto parts, if it is more convenient, a lot of the electrical components used on our R65's were in common use in European 4 wheelers of the same era.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2008, 11:40:38 AM by Bob_Roller »
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Yikes

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Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2008, 11:31:19 AM »
Wow, Bob!  Thanks for the spot-on advice.  I can see why you're a God Member.

I will give replacing the diode a shot and see what happens.  Good to know that if my soldering skills are not up to the task, the fall back plan involves replacing a $20 part.  I'll let you know what happens.

drewboid

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Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2008, 11:51:33 AM »
Replacing the diode will solve the neutral light mystery, if you carefully check the wiring diagram you should also be able to replace the relay with a radio shack or pep-boys automotive relay. As long as you are sure that the relay is getting power. A similar problem I had with my R75/6 was due to an intermittent push button switch but there the relay was not getting power.
Drew Daniels
R60/2 - LS200
R75/6
R65
R1100R

Online Bob_Roller

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Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2008, 11:58:14 AM »
When you replace the diode, be mindful of the direction it was mounted, the diode that I had, was black and had a silver band at one end, make sure you get the replacement diode in the same way, or most likely you will still have the same indication problem.
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Yikes

  • Guest
Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2008, 10:19:00 PM »
After stumping the parts guys at both NAPA and and Pep Boys with my BMW relay, I stopped at Radio Shack and picked up a two-pack of 1N4001 diodes.  I replaced the old diode in the old relay, installed it and it works great with the neutral lindicator light coming on only in neutral.  A successful fix!  Thanks Bob!  You just can't beat a repair that only costs a buck.  Unfortunately though, rain has moved in on us and I'm not going to road test it tonight.  Hopefully tomorrow will be dry enough to get back out there.

Thanks again for showing me how to kill those bugs!  Hopefully they'll stay dead for a while longer.

Offline nhmaf

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Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2008, 10:56:41 PM »
It is always great to find and fix those problems without spending a fortune at a garage !

This thread might be a good one to move to the technical FAQ section for future quick reference !
Airhead #12178 ? BMWMOA #123173 ?BMWRA #33525 ?GSBMWR #563 ?1982 BMW R65LS ?1978 BMW R100/7 1998 Kawasaki Concours

tagordon

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Re: Electric Bugs
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2008, 06:43:54 AM »
I second the motion to move this to Tech Ref section.
To allow quick access to this info.
Now, if I can even remember this info is gonna be here when I need it.
Guess I always have Google. Ain't G grand.