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Author Topic: Fork noise  (Read 2171 times)

Maz31

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Fork noise
« on: May 12, 2009, 06:16:47 AM »
I was servicing the brakes on Marilyn's bike and pumped the forks a few times to check the brakes.  I noticed a strange noise from the forks.  I put the bike on the centre stand and compressed the forks a little by lifting the front end.  When I let the front end go the fork bottoms made a loud clunk when they reached maximum extension.   I drained and filled the forks and repeated the procedure.  The 'clunk' is still there when the forks reached maximum extension - is that normal ?

Steve

Offline Barry

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #1 on: May 12, 2009, 07:03:44 AM »
The short answer is that the noise may be normal-ish.

Myself and at least one other member Williammack have the same issue and have never properly resolved it.  A search for fork noise should find a couple of previous threads on the subject.

The bump stop at full extension is a plastic bush which on my bike had gone very hard with age. New replacements are better but in my opinion still not soft enough. Other airheads have a spring and specifically the spring from an R80st should fit as the forks are otherwise almost identical.  I just haven't got round to trying this solution as my fork are not too bad and only clunk on sharp edges.
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline nhmaf

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #2 on: May 12, 2009, 09:34:01 PM »

These forks do sometimes have a mysterious noise at extreme - it could be a rubber stop at the bottom has gone (sometimes they disintegrate) or you may be low on oil ( 190cc in each leg if you just drain and replace), or around 210 -220cc if you're tearing the forks down and thus completely emptying them.   The forks in my 82 R65LS were a bit noisy after I rebuilt them until I added a bit more oil - about 230cc in each leg now - with an aftermarket spring kit.

These forks are a bit shorter than the R80's, the springs are a bit shorter and they are usually put in with a spacer for a bit of "preload".  Sometimes the noise is spring slap on the inside of the fork tube, particularly if you hear it at the upper part of the fork rather than lower in the slider area.

I suggest that you drain the fork oil and see how it looks.   If you see black chunks of plastic or hard rubber, then the problem is likely a disintegrated rubber bumper.   You will also get to see how much oil is in there (should be able to get out ~180 - 190cc).  IF you get alot less, and no bits of "stuff", maybe its just low on oil.   You can then decide whether to do a tear down or just flush and fill with new oil and see how it goes for a while.

A few pointer on the forks and oil refilling:
1. GO GENTLY on the drain bolts and DON'T follow the manual to torque them back up to 12 ft-lbs or you'll strip out the aluminim threads in the slider.  Just snug up gently with a small wrench.
2.  After you remove the top cap on each tube, there is a "plug" inside with an allen bolt.   If you're just refilling with oil hopefully the allen bolt will come out to fill through that - otherwise to remove the top plug, you must push down on it against the spring to reveal a small spring clip that fits in a groove inside the fork tube that acts as the retainer for the plug.  
3.  If you do decide to tear down the forks, DO get new crush washers for the large allen bolts at the very bottom of the fork sliders.
Airhead #12178 ? BMWMOA #123173 ?BMWRA #33525 ?GSBMWR #563 ?1982 BMW R65LS ?1978 BMW R100/7 1998 Kawasaki Concours

Offline nhmaf

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #3 on: May 12, 2009, 09:41:40 PM »
Oops, I just noticed that you said you had already drained and refilled.
If you didn't see any chunks of "stuff" in the first draining, it might be the bumper is OK, or else it is completely gone - hmmm.  Not too likely for it to be totally gone.

How much oil did you put in?

Also try doing this without the bike on the centerstand - sometimes  things can slap around under there (such as centerstand spring or sidestand against its stop that makes some funky sounds).

If you put in the 190cc amount, I might try adding another 15 or 20cc to see if it quiets down - mine did  as I had an aftermarket spring kit in which took up slightly less space than the OEM spring.
Airhead #12178 ? BMWMOA #123173 ?BMWRA #33525 ?GSBMWR #563 ?1982 BMW R65LS ?1978 BMW R100/7 1998 Kawasaki Concours

williamemack

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #4 on: May 15, 2009, 08:43:09 PM »
Hi, as Barry said above, I have the same clunk. Most noticeable going over a depressed manhole cover. Last fall I had the forks stripped by an airhead specialist. He shimmed, replaced rubber bumpers, new seals, new oil, and NO CHANGE ! At least I know the forks are OK and that it seems to be a common problem with some R65s. So, for now, I've learned to live with it.

Will

Offline Barry

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2009, 06:55:12 AM »
Thanks nhmaf.  I put in a little extra oil yesterday and this morning took the bike out to aim it at manhole covers.  At first I couldn't make the forks clunk at all then got the odd one towards the end of the ride. It's definitely made a real improvement.

So how much is enough oil ?   I'd already discovered that 190cc is not enough after a dry rebuild  last year. Haynes quote 20 - 50mm above the damper piston and I had been using a level of approx. 30mm.  Hard to believe topping up to 45mm would make a difference but it has.

I'm going to try it with a little more still - when the rain stops.

Will,
It would be interesting to know what level you are running at. You might want to try this.
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline nhmaf

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2009, 08:06:42 PM »
Glad to help - that's what we're  here for !
Airhead #12178 ? BMWMOA #123173 ?BMWRA #33525 ?GSBMWR #563 ?1982 BMW R65LS ?1978 BMW R100/7 1998 Kawasaki Concours

williamemack

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #7 on: May 18, 2009, 08:20:31 AM »
Geez Barry, wouldn't it be nice if we could cure our clonk with a couple of ccs of fork oil! I'll be interested in what you find...after the rain stops!

Will

Offline Barry

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #8 on: May 19, 2009, 12:48:54 PM »
I increased the oil level to 50mm above the damper piston last night and used the bike to go to work today. Almost immediately I could tell I'd made the fork noise worse! not better with quite a few clonks over manholes.  

I suppose  the reduced air space above the oil which acts like a progressive spring will have made the fork action a little stiffer and that may make them top out more easily. It seems there's no easy answer.

So it's back to a lower oil level maybe in 5mm stages.


  
« Last Edit: May 19, 2009, 12:49:43 PM by bhodgson »
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline Bob_Roller

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #9 on: May 19, 2009, 02:09:05 PM »
If I remember correctly, you are familiar with BMW airhead bikes, but just to mention it, what weight fork oil are you using ?

Standard oil is a 7.5 wt .
« Last Edit: May 19, 2009, 02:38:36 PM by Bob_Roller »
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Offline Barry

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #10 on: May 19, 2009, 03:14:55 PM »
I'm using Motul synthetic 5wt. Maybe I need to try something heavier.
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline Barry

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #11 on: May 20, 2009, 07:07:25 AM »
I checked the oil level last night and found it be 60mm above the damper piston when I thought I had set it at 50mm.  Anyway I reduced it to 45mm and on the way to work today there seemed to be very little noise from the forks.

There are a few things about airheads where perfection is elusive.  

What do I hear you say - just ride it!

Thats what I intend to do.


 
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline Semper Gumby

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Re: Fork noise
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2009, 07:46:59 AM »
Quote
<snip>
There are a few things about airheads where perfection is elusive.  

What do I hear you say - just ride it!

Thats what I intend to do.  

You said a mouthful!   :D
Bill Gould ?1980/03 R65 When at first you don't succeed....Moo!