Author Topic: Diode board replacement  (Read 160 times)

Offline dogshome

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Diode board replacement
« on: January 10, 2021, 11:29:54 AM »
Whilst idly being idle between work and covid/weather-induced nothingness, I decided it was time to look at the charging system. The battery never gets topped out and in the cold after a couple of weeks idling (being idle I mean) did not want to go. Looking at the upgrades they appear to based on a standard 8 big / 3 little diode block from several older cages. See pic. From Suzuki Balena and Gran Vitara and others.

It has 8 big diodes and 3 little ones and is therefore identical to the RYB&N plus sense that our airheads have.

They are about 23 delivered  8)

Bit of PCB material, ferric chloride, etc pen, PCB dpade connectors, some copper rivets, bit of time and measurement = ~45. A few more spades, bits of wire and we are over 50.

So i'm thinking the 90 delivered for a full, bolt on equivalent is pretty good!
肉(r?u)包(bāo)子(zi)打(dǎ)狗(gǒu) (meat+bun(2nd and 3rd)+hit+dog)
* Literally: To hit a dog with a meat-bun.:-O

Offline dogshome

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2021, 11:32:13 AM »
another pic
肉(r?u)包(bāo)子(zi)打(dǎ)狗(gǒu) (meat+bun(2nd and 3rd)+hit+dog)
* Literally: To hit a dog with a meat-bun.:-O

Offline Bob_Roller

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2021, 01:18:31 PM »
What kind of riding do you usually do, slow speed city type riding commute to work??
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS ?
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Offline mrclubike

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2021, 02:37:10 PM »
Ok we are having some serious tinkering fun now  ;D

Here's what I did

Convert the charging system to an "A" circuit and install a
 Yes you guessed  it
A GM 10SI voltage regulator and  diode board
Then change  the headlight and  taillight bulbs to LED
Even with a halogen bulb in the head light
After the battery has recharged from starting the bike. I have 13 volts at 1100rpm
Note that unlike the above diode board the 10SI does not have the 4th rectifier pair that is helpful at slow rpm. I had to add it
« Last Edit: January 10, 2021, 02:47:07 PM by mrclubike »
1982 R65 running tubeless Snowflakes
2004 R1150R

Offline mrclubike

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2021, 02:44:39 PM »
Whilst idly being idle between work and covid/weather-induced nothingness, I decided it was time to look at the charging system. The battery never gets topped out and in the cold after a couple of weeks idling (being idle I mean) did not want to go. Looking at the upgrades they appear to based on a standard 8 big / 3 little diode block from several older cages. See pic. From Suzuki Balena and Gran Vitara and others.

It has 8 big diodes and 3 little ones and is therefore identical to the RYB&N plus sense that our airheads have.

They are about 23 delivered  8)

Bit of PCB material, ferric chloride, etc pen, PCB dpade connectors, some copper rivets, bit of time and measurement = ~45. A few more spades, bits of wire and we are over 50.

So i'm thinking the 90 delivered for a full, bolt on equivalent is pretty good!

The diode board you are looking at is definitely more robust than the original
But I think you will see the greatest  improvement switching  over to the "A" type charging circuit and regulator

here is a good website to shop Alternator parts until  your eyes bleed  :idea2:

https://store.alternatorparts.com/rectifiers-mitsubishi.aspx
« Last Edit: January 10, 2021, 02:57:36 PM by mrclubike »
1982 R65 running tubeless Snowflakes
2004 R1150R

Offline mrclubike

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2021, 03:06:00 PM »
Here is the exploded view of my Delco diode board
1982 R65 running tubeless Snowflakes
2004 R1150R

Offline dogshome

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2021, 06:50:43 PM »
 :thumbsup:

So, type a circuit. Separating the rotor coil return. I'm not quite sure of it's function as it is on the output of the regulator. Is it simply to ensure a good rotor earth connection free of currents around the power side of the system? Or simply keeping the regulation icomponents solated from the power? I guess the latter, after some thought.

What I do see is my digital volt meter dropping to 8 or less volts when cranking today at 1C and the battery not returning to much more than 12.1V after a few seconds. 30 mins on the charger got her going, but the drop is still awful. My voltmeter is connected to the (unused) heated grip supply, not direct on the battery, so it will see cable volt drop.

I've replaced the battery negative wire and will follow up under the starter and diode covers now. 860 high compression, cold weather and 40 year old wiring is marginal. Potentially manky rectifier and regulator connections combined with maybe a bit of regulator drift won't be helping her start.
肉(r?u)包(bāo)子(zi)打(dǎ)狗(gǒu) (meat+bun(2nd and 3rd)+hit+dog)
* Literally: To hit a dog with a meat-bun.:-O

Offline dogshome

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #7 on: January 11, 2021, 10:48:18 PM »
Having looked at the alternator pron site listed above, I might chuck 1/2 doz avalanche diodes on the back of the pcb. Wish me luck with the solid metal mount nuts...
肉(r?u)包(bāo)子(zi)打(dǎ)狗(gǒu) (meat+bun(2nd and 3rd)+hit+dog)
* Literally: To hit a dog with a meat-bun.:-O

Offline dogshome

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I like to Mov it Mov it, I like to Mov it Mov it,
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2021, 02:12:15 PM »
I can make one of these cheaper ignoring all my time, but not much. There can't be a living in selling kit like this. But I'm glad someone does. I MOVed away from the Avalanche idea....

The regulator intrigues me. Why don't lead acid batteries do something sensible? Just bolt a 13.8V 3 pin switching reg in and Bobs your uncle. No, they have to do some funny chemical stuff and refuse digital control. Since I do long and short journeys in weather ranging from 1C to 30C, I might apply my brain to the 3 or 4 wired gizmo. If only temperature compensation. At least I found out what a smart alterator is so I have a clue if I break one in the future.
肉(r?u)包(bāo)子(zi)打(dǎ)狗(gǒu) (meat+bun(2nd and 3rd)+hit+dog)
* Literally: To hit a dog with a meat-bun.:-O

Offline mrclubike

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #9 on: January 17, 2021, 08:43:04 AM »
Their are other things you can do to help with keeping the battery up
I have done all of this because of using heated gear
#1 Change out the head, brake and taillight to LED 
#2 Or be able to shut off the Halogen headlight and run your LED spots instead but still get a LED tail light bulb
This what I do since I no longer have an LED Headlight bulb
LED bulbs really help the charging system, They make the high out put alternator  conversions obsolete
Here is a  picture of my volt meter at idle with just the LED floods and led tail light on
I do not know what the voltage at idle would be with the standard Bosch regulator this is with my Delco reg but I am sure it would help a lot


 
« Last Edit: January 17, 2021, 08:49:45 AM by mrclubike »
1982 R65 running tubeless Snowflakes
2004 R1150R

Offline mrclubike

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #10 on: January 17, 2021, 08:49:01 AM »
Don't waist you money on the expensive PC board Tail light conversions
Just get the Sylvania ZEVO LED's
I have them in the tail ,stop and turns
red for stop and tail
amber for the signals
trimming is required to fit tail light
« Last Edit: January 17, 2021, 08:57:52 AM by mrclubike »
1982 R65 running tubeless Snowflakes
2004 R1150R

Offline dogshome

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #11 on: January 17, 2021, 12:55:48 PM »
Swapping the positive cable to the starter motor was a bit of a game. This expanded into moving the fairing bracket to where it should be (between the cables popping out of the front cover), and general snipping of tie wraps and cleaning cable looms using baby wipes. Both ends of the big cable were quite manky as was the battery ground strap.

Getting the diode board in was a bit fiddly with RT fairing and me at ground level, but quite satisfying to move the 40 year old wires, check and clean. I'd done the brushes 3,000 miles ago and they are still OK. The electronic regulator also had manky connections and obviously has never been off. Brass brush (also used elsewhere) and a few drops of ACF here and there. The PCB was a bit scabby, so that was cleaned in solvent but otherwise looks fine. Even the 40 year old sticky fabric tape came off AND stuck back down again.

The power transistor is a BD244A PNP 6A plastic package type if anyone ever needs to replace it.

I ran out of time to fit my FIAT potted modern regulator as it wants some spades and an aluminium plate making up.

The voltmeter now reacts as it should (13.8V just above idle) and my battery charger doesn't kick in when back form a short 30 minute ride any more  :beerchug: This is more due to the cleaning and reterminating more than the diode module - the original tests fine and shows no solder heating or corrosion. The timing cover has cast-in lugs on mine so I didn't need the solid mounting kit as there were no rubber bobbins.

I am already LED'd up (apart from indicators which I might do at some point) as that is a no brainer with a tiny engine speed alternator.

About 5 hours messing with all of this today. 1hr to change both sets of rear pads on my lads Kia i20. sigh.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2021, 12:57:21 PM by dogshome »
肉(r?u)包(bāo)子(zi)打(dǎ)狗(gǒu) (meat+bun(2nd and 3rd)+hit+dog)
* Literally: To hit a dog with a meat-bun.:-O

Offline Justin B.

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Re: Diode board replacement
« Reply #12 on: January 17, 2021, 03:44:09 PM »
Well, look on the bright side - Kia brakes, every couple of years but you're good for another 40 years on the electrical!  :ROTFLMAO:
Justin B.

2004 BMW R1150RT
1981 R100RT - Summer bike, NEKKID!!!