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Author Topic: Push Rod Tubes  (Read 1608 times)

tog123

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Push Rod Tubes
« on: February 17, 2014, 01:33:24 PM »
hi there can anyone help me with this one ? When fitting new push rod tubes and the after market base gaskets that are 0.75mm. Thick will I have to take that into account when pressing in the new tubes ? All advice very gratefully received thanks   :-?

Offline Bob_Roller

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2014, 01:44:57 PM »
Are you working on an R65 ????

There are no cylinder base gaskets on an R65, just thin o-rings on the cylinder itself at the bottom .

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do?model=0363&mospid=51897&btnr=11_1707&hg=11&fg=11
« Last Edit: February 17, 2014, 01:47:55 PM by Bob_Roller »
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Offline montmil

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2014, 03:49:31 PM »
There's a large o-ring -93x2.2 mm- that serves as the base 'gasket'. BMW # 11.11.1337567. Also there are two smaller o-rings that go over the upper cylinder stubs -11x2 mm. BMW # 11.11.1262141. These are for the oil passages that feed the rockers.

You'll also need head gaskets and, possibly, rocker box gaskets. And don't forget the pushrod tubes seals. The molded line on the seals faces down during installation. A little oil on the inside of the pushrod tube seal and a bit on the engine case helps the install.
   Do not use any form of gasket sealer on the tube seals as they must be allowed to 'move' just a wee bit due to engine case heat expansion during ops.

Some folks like to use a very, very thin smear of YamaBond on the case to cylinder base joint. Keep this stuff well away from those small oil ring oil passages. Your call on this.
Monte Miller
Denton, TEXAS
1978 BMW R100S
1981 BMW R65
1983 BMW R65
1995 Triumph Trophy
1986 VW Cabriolet

tog123

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2014, 06:54:39 PM »
yes it is a 79 r65 the base gaskits i am on about are sold by motorworks as a cure for the weep from the bottom of the pots. i just want it to stop spraying my left boot with oil and have been told tube placement has to be spot on or thay leek or the heads come lose  :-?

Offline Bob_Roller

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2014, 07:00:58 PM »
If you place a gasket on the bottom flange of the cylinder, I would think that the pushrod tubes won't be seated or sealed properly and cause an oil leak .

You have a leak at the cylinder base because the o-ring's there are worn out and need to be replaced .
'81 R65
'82 R65 LS
'84 R65 LS
'87 Moto Guzzi V65 Lario
'02 R1150R
Riding all year long since 1993 .
I'll give up my R65, when they pry my cold dead hands from the handlebars !!!!!

Offline Tony Smith

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2014, 07:42:10 PM »
Quote
When fitting new push rod tubes and the after market base gaskets that are 0.75mm. Thick will I have to take that into account when pressing in the new tubes ?

No.
 
The seals are compressible - by far your more immediate problem is to press in the new tubes without buggering them. When I did mine the seller of the stainless steel tubes I bought suggested purchasing an extra one as a spare against "accidents".

I didn't need it, but I can perhaps give you some tips to avoid you ending up in pain.

First, using a few bits of timber, make a fixture that will support the head such that the bores into which the pushrod tubes will go are as near to vertical as possible. If you are lucky enough to have a vice big enough to hold the fixture, great, otherwise some adjustable clamps will suffice. The advantage of the vice is that you can see the bottom of the bores and can therefore more easily judge when to stop.

Next, using a very fine sandpaper and kerosense (or steel wool if you prefer) clean the pushrod tube bores to remove any "roughness", go careful and do not use anything that is going to increase the bore diameter, clean and bright is the target - do not remove the "ledge" that resulted the last time pushrod tubes were driven in, this is your witness mark to ensure that your new tubes are seated far enough.
 
Puts heads in oven at 220 degrees centigrade for about 30 minutes, put pushrod tubes in freezer for about the same length of time after first smearing the thinnest possible amount of something with some lubricity on the ends that are going into the heads, I used a light silicon grease that I normally use on bicycles - be sparing.

Next, remove your rear axle, this just happens to be the perfect size to use as a driver to drive the pushrod tubes in - alternatively, turn a suitable length of bright mild down in a lathe and use that. Whichever you use - put it in freezer with the pushrod tubes.

Remove heads from oven, mount on your fixture. Remove axle and the lucky first pushrod tube from freezer. Hold pushrod tube over the bore you select with axle (or your own home made driver) inserted and gently start it into the bore. Then grasp your 5lb hammer and smite the end of your axle - adjust next blow in accordance with how far it moved on the first one. You will probably know when the tube reaches the "ledge' if not, look carefully after each smiteing. Don't go too far cause backing it out is a bastard.
 
If you succeed, put axle back in feezer for 15 minutes and do the next one. If you crumple or bend the pushrod tube - go and do something else, today is not your day to be driving pushrod tubes.

Do note stress too much about being overly accurate with the exposed length of pushrod tube, within reasonable limits the seal will crush down to accommodate minor inaccuracy.

Now, I am pretty sure that freezing will work I just happened to have a liquid delivery LPG cylinder and gave the tube I was about to drive and the axle a bath in rapidly boiling LPG in a piece of plastic downpipe - they were very cold.

You really only have a few seconds to get the tube home as it is very thing and heat transfers from the head very quickly, although the cold axle does slow this down a bit.


Lots of luck


Tony Smith

Remove head from oven, set in fixture - i
1978 R100RS| 1981 R100RS (JPS) | 1984 R65 | 1992 KLE500 | 2002 R1150GSA |

tog123

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2014, 07:59:00 PM »
yes i think so too i have a compleat gaskit and seal kit thay even droped in a free decompreshon ring for a r60 just to keep gessing what that was for have i been sold somthing i dont need these base gaskits will reduse compreshon as she's getting on a bit now

tog123

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #7 on: February 17, 2014, 08:34:56 PM »
thanks tony thats what i wanted to know have got the tubes at-18 in bate freezer my bro's making a base plate up that will hold the pot at the right angle so he can press them in with a quill press what ever that is this started as a seal change then i found a tube repear  :-/

Offline Tony Smith

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #8 on: February 17, 2014, 10:58:43 PM »
Quote
First, using a few bits of timber, make a fixture that will support the head such that the bores into which the pushrod tubes will go are as near to vertical as possible.

Aarrgh! I really did say "head". Brain fade, replace every instance of "head" with "barrel" I really do not know what I was thinkign other than perhaps because I am about to replace the valve guides I am a bit fixated on heads at present.
1978 R100RS| 1981 R100RS (JPS) | 1984 R65 | 1992 KLE500 | 2002 R1150GSA |

Offline Tony Smith

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Re: Push Rod Tubes
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2014, 11:02:48 PM »
Quote
my bro's making a base plate up that will hold the pot at the right angle so he can press them in with a quill press

Your brother has a quill press and I am envious.
 
My brother would know how to use a quill press he is after all a qualified electrical fitter/mechanic and instrument fitter. But he became a priest many years ago and does not do any "trade" work anymore.
1978 R100RS| 1981 R100RS (JPS) | 1984 R65 | 1992 KLE500 | 2002 R1150GSA |