Starting problem..???

[Semper Gumby]

Hi CafeRR,

I see you have a automotive inline filter on your fuel line.  Get ride of it.  The China stuff is crap and restrictive.  There is an Emgo filter that is a screen I may try that but I will never put an automotive inline filter on my Gravity Feed bikes ever again.

There is a metal strainer inside of the fuel petcock.  That is enough.  Just make sure that once a year you remove and clean your tank and clean the petcock strainer out.  

Also look at the condition of the fuel hoses.  If there are any cracks on the ends of the hose then you are well past due for new hoses.  Hose life with todays weird fuels is 2-4 years(?)

The last thing to do is to check your float bowls at oil changes.  Look for crap in the bowls and then work your way backwards to the source of the crap.   If its red then it's the lining from the tank failing.  If its black then its prolly the hoses.

Good luck.  We are all counting on you.   8-)

[Luca]

Not to be rude, but...

The China stuff is crap and restrictive.

It doesn't matter unless it's too restrictive.  I've got a more restrictive than metalpaper element automotive inline filter from Autozone on my bike.  Not exactly "China crap"  --It has "made in Israel" printed on it-- but it wasn't expensive.  I can bury the speedo for 20 minutes and the bike doesn't give one hiccough.  How much more can you ask for?  Besides, there is a very simple fuel delivery test to make sure enough gas is getting to your carbs.  The engine doesn't need more than enough.

The last thing to do is to check your float bowls at oil changes.  Look for crap in the bowls and then work your way backwards to the source of the crap.   If its red then it's the lining from the tank failing.  If its black then its prolly the hoses.
 

...if you find red crap in your carb bowls then clearly the metal strainer is not doing its job

Anywho, his problem is with getting the bike running.  As long as he can get clean gas to the carbs it should run for a couple minutes before it runs the bowls down anyways.

[Semper Gumby]

 Not exactly "China crap"  --It has "made in Israel" printed on it-- but it wasn't expensive.  

I remember mechanics when they saw "Made in Israel' would roll their eyes and then would start swearing.  It was a long time ago but never-the-less....  

Actually I don't think "Made in Israel" or "Made in China" has anything to do with it.   Something about the paper elements and the Ethanol fuel is a bad combination.  The paper inline filters are restrictive in a *short* time.  This is my experience doing daylong rides with the BSA and BMW up and down the east coast.  They are a bad idea unless you have an electric pump providing pressure.  

This is my experience...

As aways your results may vary.

[Dizerens5]

Did you replace the carb floats? Did you check that the starter valve discs were not switched left and right (easy mistake to make..)., if that was done somebody may have tried to compensate for weak starting mixture by raising the fuel level through modifying the float tabs. Restoring the correct level will make the engine very hard to start.

[Semper Gumby]

Kriky I completely forgot.  

Check the jet that is in the float bowl ( there is a hole in the bottom corner of the float bowl.)  

The jet is pressed in the bottom of the tube.  So get a can of carb cleaner and put the red end of the plastic tube into the hole in the bottom corner of the float bowl.  Point the open end of the float bowl away from your face (and any other paint surface  - like a car or another bike).  And spray.  I fine jet of carb cleaner should come out the tube in the corner of the float bowl.  if it doesn't then unclog it.  Betcha the bike starts better now.

Some body will know what sized jet it is and the #of the really tiny drill bit you need to unclog it.  I have just such a tool for the BSA's as they clog much easier than the BMWs.


Good luck.

[Barry]

Some body will know what sized jet it is and the #of the really tiny drill bit you need to unclog it.I have just such a tool for the BSA's as they clog much easier than the BMWs.

Bing quote 44-031/66 which must mean a size 66 jet.

That translates to 0.024" or a number 73 drill.

I just use some thin wire but for a really stubborn blockage I guess you might need the drill.

[montmil]

The small fuel reservoir in the corner of the float bowl feeds the enrichener circuit. The enricheners are actually small carburetors although most everyone refers to them as "chokes". Fuel enters the enrichener circuit reservoir through that small hole in the bottom of the float bowl. No fuel in there, starting will be difficult.

As Barry noted, a small length of copper wire will clear all but the most stubborn clogs.

[Ctino]

Cheers for the replies,
Got at the bike for a few hours this evening, still no luck with getting her running.
@constillation, The floats were not replaced and the choke discs have been checked.

The small jet in the float is unblocked and tested. The ultrasonic cleaner took care of that.

I done the valve clearances today right side was a bit tight. Also done a compression test, which had to be done on a cold engine nothing i could do there. Both cylinders are running at the same around 155 psi, i dont know if thats good or bad??
After all this put it back together went to start again with the coke fully on. whined for about 5 seconds started and cut out after two. Tried a second third and fourth time nothing, pulled the carbs off to see wtf is going on. On the intake there seems to be a puddle of fuel just before the valve opening. Took the spark plugs out to see whats going on inside the cylinder there was mist or smoke not sure which.
 
Any advice on what could be going on??

[Bob_Roller]

I had similar issues with my '81 R65 .

Here's what happened to me, couldn't get the bike to start, removed all of the parts and put them in an ultresonic cleaner for 12 hours, thought that evrything had to be clean .

I checked the idle jets with aerosol carb cleaner, I placed the plastic tube up against the end with the screwdriver slot, sprayed cleaner into it and it sprayed out .

What I didn't realize at the time, is that the carb cleaner was coming out of the two sets of holes drilled into the body of the jet about half way down .

The very end of the jet has the metered orifice that controls fuel flow, on both of my idle jets this orifice at the end was clogged .

Had a devil of a time getting them cleaned out without opening up the hole any larger than it should be .

Once they were clear, no more problems .

Even when this hole is clear, it's very difficult to tell its clear just by looking at it .

It may or may not be your issue, but it's a quick check type item on both carbs .

Hope this helps you out !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Barry]

Both cylinders are running at the same around 155 psi, i dont know if thats good or bad??  

I wouldn't worry, that's a very good figure. Be worth checking again when hot. Anything above 145 psi on a hot engine is classed as excellent.

What I didn't realize at the time, is that the carb cleaner was coming out of the two sets of holes drilled into the body of the jet about half way down.

Those are the air emulsion holes. Air is supposed to go in through those holes mix with the fuel and the air/fuel mixture then should go out the hole in the top of the jet - which in this case was blocked.

[Ctino]

Good and bad news...
I took the carbs back off blew out the holes in question. Put it all back together, went to start her with the choke fully on. Fired up perfect holding at about 2000 rpm, just as i was about to celebrate she died. It was the longest i had her started for, she went for about 20 seconds. On subsequent start nothing, nothing, nothing and nothing!!!!!

Any ideas???

[Barry]

I'd check the plugs to see if they are wet. They don't like full choke for long especially at this time of year. Well mine doesn't like the choke  at all until it's well below 10 Deg C. I Haven't used the choke since last March/April and probably won't until October/November.

[Luca]

Any ideas???

My thought is you picked up another piece of sediment.

Replace the fuel lines and filters if they aren't new.

Use carb cleaner to blow out your carb passages and follow with compressed air.

Make sure the air filter is clean.  I've never heard of this happening, but maybe it's possible to get grit, fluff, etc. into one of the small air inlets at the mouth of the carburetor.

[Ctino]

Ok, so there was a mix up in my shed with gas canisters and it turns out i was trying to start the bike with diesel....  :-/

Good news is the bike runs perfect starts with no choke,every time so far...

Sorry to have  hounded you all over this....

[steve hawkins]

Glad you found out before you did any damage.

Although if you did not start it.......

Rev. light