'83 R65 Wheel Bearing Adjustment

[flybot]

Hello,
Im trying to figure out if there is anything more to adjusting the wheel bearings than just proper torque of the axle bolt. I have an '83 R65, and Im not satisfied with the stability. The bike tracks just fine, but if you give the handlebar a shake while riding it it feels very wobly.

During my bikes restoration last summer, I replaced all the wheel bearings and torqued them according to the owners manual. I tried to read Snowbums info on preload. That guy has probably forgotten more airhead info than Ill ever know. But I get a headache everytime I try to read through his stuff. Way too much info. Just give me the quick facts.

So, is there some sort of shimming and preload set up I need to be doing? Or do I just torque the axle bolts down to get it right on an'83?

Ive gone through and replaced the swingarm, and head bearings. All seem good. I really suspect the rear wheel bearings.

Any ideas?

[Bob_Roller]

There is a shimming/preload adjustment on the bearings .

Between the two bearings in a wheel, there is a long and short metal spacer, possibly thin shims between the two spacers .

The dimension of this assembly, gives you the proper preload on the bearings when you tighten the axle nut down .

[steve hawkins]

Are your tyres good?  Is the rear squared off?  What condition is the front?

How is your head set?  Not notchy or any tightness?

Is the correct oil and amount in the front legs?

How are you rear shocks set?  much preload?  I am thinking about level ride height, if the bikes rear end is in the air then the front will be skittish/quick steering.

There are many things to check before pulling your bearings apart.  I have not touched mine for years.....

The bike has shorter wheel base than the larger twins due to the shorter swing arm.  This gives the bike the reputation of being a bit lively to the riders of the larger airheads, etc.

I am not trying to teach you to suck eggs, but what makes you think that it is the bearings?  After all your set them up according to the manual...Just trying to get a better overall impression of the state of the machine.

Cheers

Rev. light

[flybot]

The bike is "fully restored" with about 6700 total miles on it. I did the resto my self. Thread here: http://www.bmwr65.org/cgi-bin/yabb2/YaBB.pl?num=1346783584/0 All I can say is that Ive replaced all the bearings on the machine, and gone over all the usual suspects, filled and rechecked all the fluids, etc.

I suspect the rear bearings for two reasons: First, when its up on the center stand, I can grab the top and bottom of the rear wheel and try to rock the top of the wheel (not spin it, but push/pull the top of the wheel) and see the gap between the rear drive and the wheel hub change very slightly. I dont hear or feel any knocking though. Second, when cruising, if I let off and back on the gas quickly, I get a very slight fishtail weave. Doesnt feel good on turns.

I took the rear wheel off yesterday to do a quick check of the bearings and they feel fine. It just doesnt seem like they are tight enough and there is bearing slop.

When I had it apart with the bearing replacment, there was a spacer tube between the bearings, but no thin shims. Then it had the outer "hat" spacers under the seals.

[Bob_Roller]

None of my R65's had any shims between the spacers .

You mentioned that you replaced the bearings, so that may require checking and adjusting .

With the axle nut tightened up and you have 'play' in the wheel, most likely you need to check the preload of the bearings .

[Barry]

When I had it apart with the bearing replacement, there was a spacer tube between the bearings, but no thin shims. Then it had the outer "hat" spacers under the seals.  

There is not necessarily a thin shim as that is an after factory build adjustment but there should have been a "wedding band" which is a short sleeve available in various lengths of I think 2 thou increments.  

[Bob_Roller]

Here's a kit that is available from Cycle Works .

It has the smaller spacer in a thinner size and shims to go between the spacers if needed .

http://www.cycleworks.net/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=29_41_44&products_id=204

[tvrla]

Is the axle nut tightened to spec? I think it should be something like 32 ft lbs.

If there's play in the bearings still, then it needs a thinner wedding band. There needs to be a slight bit of loading on the bearings for best operation and life. I've heard Harley specs zero preload and no play, and they hold up just fine. Or so I've heard.

[flybot]

Yes, the nut is tightened to spec. Ive checked it several times. Seems strange because there is very little info on this preload adjustment on the web. I read through snowbums 25 page tome again and it doesnt really address the rear wheel. Although I think the jig he made up must work for both. I guess Ill have to use the "feel" method to get it right. Im not making a jig, and Ive adjusted plenty of bearings in my day. And Ill order up the kit Bob_Roller posted.

Because of the lack of information, I take it they dont need much preload adjustment once its set up right. Thats good.

Does anyone have any info from a Clymer's manual or similar? I know I need to go thinner on the wedding ring to get the bearings to go tighter into the cone. I guess to start Ill measure the current wedding ring and go tighter by a few thousandths.

Thanks for all the help guys. Ill post the progress when the kit arrives and definitely write an "abbreviated" How-to.

[Bob_Roller]

I've always questioned this method that BMW has for these bearings .

I don't know how many rotors and brake drums I've removed in the last 40 years, the wheel bearings are held in by the grease seals, you install the rotor or drum, put the axle nut on torque it down to seat the bearing, back off until it's free, then tighten the nut until you feel a bit of resistance and put a cotter pin in the nut .

How many wheel bearing failures have you experienced in owning a car

I wonder if you didn't have the spacers between the bearings on a BMW bike, if you torqued the axle nut down until the was no free play, if you would have any bearing issues ??

[flybot]

I think the forks would flex too much to tighten them that way. But there has to be a better way. I'll have to look up how my VRod bearings work. They have never been a problem.

[Armen]

The way I was taught:
Remove the bearings and clean them well.
Shoot some WD-40 on the bearings. Not grease.
Assemble the bearings and spacers without seals. You'll need something to take up the space normally occupied by the fork legs or rear end. I cut up some old handlebars to different lengths.
Torque the axle nut to 32 ft/lbs.
The axle should spin with no drag and no play. Try different spacers until you are right on. If the size you need falls between two shims, thin the spacer on a lathe or carefully with a file.
Grease up the bearings and reassemble.
Hardley Dangerous used to spec a few thousands of an inch in clearance, then changed their spec to no play, no drag like BMW.
-Armen

[Barry]

If you need to narrow the wedding band by a couple of thou you could just lap it down by that much or turn it down if you have access to a lathe. No need for the kit.

Before all that you have to be sure that bearing spacing is the cause of your problem. Leave out the wedding band and very cautiously tighten the axle nut probably no more than hand tight to see if the play goes away.  

[Bob_Roller]

The front wheel, you can install it on the front forks, without the calipers installed and perform the adjustment procedure .

The rear, I made up a fixture from two jack stands made up a 'spacer' to take up the dimension of the final drive width on the rear axle, with a piece of cast iron water pipe .

Used clamps to secure the axle to the jack stands and did the adjustment procedure off of the bike .

[flybot]

Those are all great ideas. I think I can work something up with black pipe and jack stands. Sounds pretty easy.
I think as someone mentioned, I can just lap the existing spacer down. I ordered the kit anyway, since I had to get new seals as well.