oils aint oils....... or are they

[oz_johnno]

I was shopping at the supermarket and saw 5 litres of valvoline 20w50 on sale for $12.

Now I know that generally car oils are no good in bikes because of the various friction modifiers added to the oil and the effects these have on the clutch plates of wet clutches.

The question is, given that the R65 has a much heavier oil in the gearbox, can I use this cheap oil in my R65?

How often do you guys change the engine oil?

OZ

[Barry]

There shouldn't  be any friction modifiers in a 20W50 oil and in any case as you say it's a non issue for dry clutch bikes.

The usual concern is % reduction in ZDDP boundary lubricants because they contaminate the Cats on modern cars. Again 20W50 is not marketed for modern cars so you are in with a chance that ZDDP hasn't been reduced.

My personal opinion is the ZDDP issue is overblown because it's based on the clear cut premise that All new engines have roller cam followers and so don't need boundary lubricants. That can't be true. It also ignores the fact that ZDDP may have been substituted with other types of boundary lubricant that don't contaminate Cats.

My current preference is to look for oil that meets European Acea A3/B3 standards which means it's a dual purpose oil suitable for gasoline engines and light duty diesels. That usually means a 15W40 though so I'm not sure if the same ACEA standards apply to a 20W50. What standards does this Valvoline 20W50 meet ?

I change oil once per year which for me is approx. 3000 miles. Transmission oils every other year.

[Motu]

A 20-50 won't meet an ACEA standard because no modern engine manufacturer uses it. So they can do whatever they like with it. So long as it's not super low budget oil a good 20-50 should be good. I'm using Valvoline XLD Classic because it's a real cool sounding name and because it's cheap.

[raypond]

I've used nothing but that Valvoline 20/50 in my R65 for eight years and 100,000km now. My valve guides seemed to wear quickly but we'll never know whether that was because of the oil. Otherwise it seems good. It's cheap so change it often.

[Session101]

I read a report on comparison of all the top brands of synthetic oil. I don't remember who was the best because it was super expensive, but for the value and the viscosity of holding up after X amount of miles, I went with AMSoil 20w50. I think i paid like 10 bucks a qt at one of the local shops. It showed to be the best without breaking the bank.

[oz_johnno]

yeah a friend of mine uses nothing but cheap oil in his zzr1100 and its been going for over 200,000km (about 80,000 miles methinks).  he reckons its all about the frequency of the oil change rather than the type of oil you use.

He changes his when he feels the gear change starting to get a little 'notchy'

I will go with the valvoline........ and put a new filter on.

OZ

[Adrian]

http://www.mctrader.com.au/news-and-reviews/article/articleid/79687.aspx

Hi there from Adelaide 0z_johnno - above is the Australian Motorcycle Trader magazine article about oils - written by Spannerman - the then resident guru on all things motorcycles. I have run my 1984 R65 on synthetic oil since I bought it in 1992 but since reading this article and other info from bike gurus like Spannerman I am going to stick to the recommended oil in the workshop manual. As I'm restoring the bike at the moment I will have the opportunity to start over - as it were - with oils in the engine etc as if from new.
I hope this helps you to decide - I believe it is important to use the correct oils  always - although I accept that opinion is devided on this issue as it is on many others. I looked at the "expert" advice from the likes of  Spannerman - read a great deal on this forum as well - and then made my decision. Take care mate - Adrian .........

[Barry]

Since you mention publications in OZ I came across an article on this Australian Jaguar Drivers club site.  It's by far the most common sense assessment of the ZDDP issue I've read.  

http://www.jaguarhunter.org.au/Technical_Pages/Modern_Engine_Oils.htm

The key points for me were:-

Not all oil specification place limits on ZDDP

It's not as simple as comparing the declared % ZDDP content as the restrictions have driven new more effective formulations of ZDDP.

Too much ZDDP is as bad or worse than too little. The whole issue is so complex that unless you are a oil professional it's got to be better to buy quality oil than add ZDDP as an after market additive.

The ACEA specifications have tougher valve train wear tests than API

ZDDP protection doesn't even work unless the oil gets hot on a regular basis. This is a real issue for me in the winter and I'm going to have to think of some way of limiting cooling. Look out for pictures with my engine wearing ear muffs !

[montmil]

Common Sense and Jaguar Owners ?

Isn't that an oxymoron?

[nhmaf]

I suppose a few JAg owners might have a bit of common sense - I know one who at least own the XJ series sedan (saloon) and that was the most practical of all Jags - though it still spent about 3 out of every 12 months in the shop..

[Barry]

I suppose old Jags are very nice if not entirely sensible. What impressed me about the guy besides 30 years experience was the absence of hysteria in his assessment of the the ZDDP problem. I always believed it was not a simple black and white issues nor a problem of the magnitude many make it out to be.