Excessive Shift Lever Play?

[Barry]

I think most of the movement on my R65 comes from the end play of the shift lever on its mounting bolt/screw.I did not replace the mounting bolt/screw as it did not seem to be worn, but this would be an obvious thing to try.Before I do that, I’ll insert a thin shortening shim/washer under the mounting bolt/screw head as I think this could well make the world of difference. Has anyone else taken this route?
 

Resurrecting this thread from a few months back... I have just taken that route. Did you ever fit a shim ?

With nothing to do on a rainy Sunday afternoon I was looking around the bike for a job and descended upon the sloppy gear lever. I didn't believe it should be worn at 12,000 miles and sure enough after a dismantle and clean it was as you suggested excessive end play which was probably mostly there from new. Measuring the gap at 0.016" I made up a 0.015" shim washer and what a difference it made.  All the wobble has gone even with the "bent wire" Linkage the gear change was very positive on the ride to work today.

My gearlever had no needle roller bearing and no bush but did have a grease nipple and a groove on the mounting bolt to distribute the grease.

[R65_Mark]

Resurrecting this thread from a few months back... I have just taken that route. Did you ever fit a shim ?

With nothing to do on a rainy Sunday afternoon I was looking around the bike for a job and descended upon the sloppy gear lever. I didn't believe it should be worn at 12,000 miles and sure enough after a dismantle and clean it was as you suggested excessive end play which was probably mostly there from new. Measuring the gap at 0.016" I made up a 0.015" shim washer and what a difference it made.All the wobble has gone even with the "bent wire" Linkage the gear change was very positive on the ride to work today.

My gearlever had no needle roller bearing and no bush but did have a grease nipple and a groove on the mounting bolt to distribute the grease.  

Barry,

No shim yet.  I've been distracted from working on my R65 due to a recent arrival - a '74 TR5T.  Now that you've gone down this route with success, I'll move the job up my list and report back in due course.

Mark

[Graeme]

I just received a needle bearing from Motobins in the UK. Cost about $5. (I had to order some sidestand springs to get it up to $10 min purchase)

I haven't fitted it yet but I did disassemble first before ordering to check on what was required.

53910 CLUTCH ARM PIVOT NEEDLE BEARING ALL TWINS 1981 ON...) 1 4.85 4.85


EDIT: Hmmm, after posting this I noticed "clutch." My gearlever certainly has a worn needle bearing at the pivot & what I received looks identical. I might have to check this tomorow  :-?

[Graeme]

 [smiley=thud.gif] Am I embarresed? I removed the lever & prepared to replace the needle bearing, went to get it from where (I thought) I'd put it...not there & can't find it anywhere. I'll have to order another if I can't find it & put it all back together until it arrives.

Anyway, a machined bush would certainly do the job but the OEM would be so much cheaper & quicker.

[Ben_Carufel]

I think most of the movement on my R65 comes from the end play of the shift lever on its mounting bolt/screw.I did not replace the mounting bolt/screw as it did not seem to be worn, but this would be an obvious thing to try.Before I do that, I’ll insert a thin shortening shim/washer under the mounting bolt/screw head as I think this could well make the world of difference. Has anyone else taken this route?
 

Resurrecting this thread from a few months back... I have just taken that route. Did you ever fit a shim ?

With nothing to do on a rainy Sunday afternoon I was looking around the bike for a job and descended upon the sloppy gear lever. I didn't believe it should be worn at 12,000 miles and sure enough after a dismantle and clean it was as you suggested excessive end play which was probably mostly there from new. Measuring the gap at 0.016" I made up a 0.015" shim washer and what a difference it made.  All the wobble has gone even with the "bent wire" Linkage the gear change was very positive on the ride to work today.

My gearlever had no needle roller bearing and no bush but did have a grease nipple and a groove on the mounting bolt to distribute the grease.

Barry,

I installed Justins upgraded shift linkage this afternoon to replace my stock bent wire linkage.

I have the same setup with the grease nipple and groove on the mounting bolt. There was no stock bearing in mine. I noticed the same play as you; though I didn't measure it, there is definitely a side to side movement.

Can you explain to me how you made up the shim washer? What'd you use? I'd be interested in doing the same thing, if I'm capable...

Thanks!

Ben

[Graeme]

I just received a needle bearing from Motobins in the UK. Cost about $5. (I had to order some sidestand springs to get it up to $10 min purchase)

I haven't fitted it yet but I did disassemble first before ordering to check on what was required.

53910 CLUTCH ARM PIVOT NEEDLE BEARING ALL TWINS 1981 ON...) 1 4.85 4.85


EDIT: Hmmm, after posting this I noticed "clutch." My gearlever certainly has a worn needle bearing at the pivot & what I received looks identical. I might have to check this tomorow  :-?

I fitted the above needle bearing about an hour ago after removing the old one with a drift. I'll give it a run tomorrow but what I removed was identical to what I ordered above from Motobins. It certainly feels better.

[Barry]

Can you explain to me how you made up the shim washer? What'd you use?  

Well it wasn't a very elegant engineering process. I punched a washer out of some 0.020" shim steel. Anyone who has tried to cut shim steel with hand punches will understand the result was less than perfect. After that it needed tidying up and then a laborious process of hand lapping the washer down to 0.015".   5 thou doesn't sound like much to remove but it took quite a while and a few trial fits to check the lever wasn't binding when the pivot screw was tightened up. It might be possible to buy a shim washer from a specialist engineering supplier and we do have a good one in town. I suppose I spent several hours producing something that might cost very little but it was something to do on a rainy Sunday.

[R65_Mark]

I just bought a 0.032" thick 5/8"id./1"od. brass laminated peel-away shim set from McMaster-Carr for this job.  Pt. No. 90805A163.  The shims are in 0.002" increments, so it should be a matter of peeling away layers and testing until the feel is just right.  I'll probably get to this job next weekend and will report back on outcome then.

Mark

[Rob Valdez 79 R65]

I just bought a 0.032" thick 5/8"id./1"od. brass laminated peel-away shim set from McMaster-Carr for this job.  Pt. No. 90805A163.  The shims are in 0.002" increments, so it should be a matter of peeling away layers and testing until the feel is just right.  I'll probably get to this job next weekend and will report back on outcome then.

Mark

Say Mark, perhaps you should consider becoming the U.S. distributor for this item?
http://www.mcmaster.com/#90805a163/=b74b9z

There is no MM-C store near me, and I shudder to think of what they would charge to mail-order one laminated shim.

I would suspect brass would be a better material in this application than steel?
I could order a package of 10 0.020 3/8" ID shims in steel from Grainger, locally for $11, and have them delivered to my local store + sales tax.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/Arbor-Shim-5FY88?Pid=search

But then I would have 9 sitting in a drawer and one hardened steel one rubbing away at my aluminum parts.

Just musing, really.  Like I said - I've not noticed a real issue with excess play, myself.

[Barry]

I just bought a 0.032" thick 5/8"id./1"od. brass laminated peel-away shim set from McMaster-Carr for this job.

Peel away shims !

Whatever next from the land where you can buy anything.

Brilliant idea - I'm seriously jealous.

[R65_Mark]

Say Mark, perhaps you should consider becoming the U.S. distributor for this item?
http://www.mcmaster.com/#90805a163/=b74b9z

There is no MM-C store near me, and I shudder to think of what they would charge to mail-order one laminated shim.

I would suspect brass would be a better material in this application than steel?
I could order a package of 10 0.020 3/8" ID shims in steel from Grainger, locally for $11, and have them delivered to my local store + sales tax.
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/Arbor-Shim-5FY88?Pid=search

To me, brass = bearing material, so that's the way I've gone.  Catalog has them as $6.34 ea.

On the rare occasions I've had to order small items from McMaster Carr for home delivery, the next-day freight has been less than $10 (there's only one freight option - and I don't think they calc. freight with on-line orders on the fly, so it's a little bit of a black hole).  My new job, like my old, is on a regular drop route and being at the end of the runway at Dobbins Air Reserve Base/Lockheed Martin (think C-130J Super Hercules and F-22 Raptor) means there all kinds of support shops/services in the area that I'm just getting to know.

Happy to help out fellow R65 etc folks.  Let me see how these shims work out before setting any ball rolling.

[Rob Valdez 79 R65]

On the rare occasions I've had to order small items from McMaster Carr for home delivery, the next-day freight has been less than $10 (there's only one freight option - and I don't think they calc. freight with on-line orders on the fly, so it's a little bit of a black hole).  

Yeah - I got far enough into the online order process last night to where it asked me for my credit card information, and it still hadn't given me a shipping price yet, so I just closed the window - I wasn't that curious!

I have a hard time paying $10 for something that will fit in a 1st-class envelope for 50 cents or so.  Especially when the part only costs a little over $6.
I don't think that is too Monte-like, yet!

[montmil]

. . . I don't think that is too Monte-like, yet!

I heard that!

Monte

[Rob Valdez 79 R65]

. . . I don't think that is too Monte-like, yet!

I heard that!

Monte

My job & career in IT is looking more precarious every day.  I am rapidly taking your principals to heart!

[R65_Mark]

Installed my peel-away brass shim on my R65 gear shift today. � Big improvement in lever end wobble/free play. � Notes below and a lesson learned.

My R65 (1984 23,000 miles) gear lever had about 7 or 8mm of lateral free play before I started this modification (I had already fitted a new needle bearing a while back thinking this might help, but it hadn’t). � By comparison the same measurement on my R100RT (1994 33,000 miles) showed no more than 2 mm lateral free play (more miles but less gear changing wear and tear?). � After the modification the end free play on my R65 is about the same as my R100RT.

I posted a very short before and after video clip on YouTube here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqval1PL1V0

This really was a ten minute start to finish job.

I used a 5/8-in id, 1-in od, 0.032-in shim and ended up peeling away three 0.002-in layers. � I simply took the lever off the ‘bike, trial-fitted the shim a few times and stopped taking layers away once I had a non-binding fit.

The 5/8-in id, 1-in od shim is really not the right size. � I bought it before having the mechanism apart, so size was a guess. � If I were to do this again (and I probably will just to do this job “right”) I’d use a 1/2-in id, 3/4-in od shim (McMaster Carr #90805A162).

The cost was Shim $6.34, Tax $0.64, Shipping $4.38, Total $11.36. � The smaller diameter shim is a little cheaper. � Shipping varies depending what else is in the order and whether it is a residential drop or business. � This was a business drop and it was the only item in the order so I took the fullest hit I could on the shipping rate.

Mark