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Author Topic: oil on the move  (Read 919 times)

chris_blake

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oil on the move
« on: February 27, 2010, 02:03:05 AM »
just done oil change 86 r65 mono and found oil in gearbox low but full to top of swingarm obviously a seal gone somewhere any ideas before i start the oil was last checked about 6 months 6000 miles ago and was fine any help much appreciated cheers chris

Offline Rob Valdez 79 R65

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Re: oil on the move
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2010, 03:01:11 AM »
It is migrating from the transmission to the driveshaft tunnel via the transmissions output seal.

I'm not sure, but I think the output flange has to be removed from the gearbox.  That should be the hardest part.
I think the seal can be replaced without removing the back cover.
The seal goes in backward of what most seals do, so make sure you have it right before putting the new on in.

Please be clear that I have never done any of this before, so check my thoughts before proceeding.

Offline Barry

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Re: oil on the move
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2010, 03:34:41 AM »
Might worth checking the hole is clear in the gearbox breather/battery lead earth bolt before any major undertaking.

Oil moving around between the transmission assemblies is not that uncommon on airheads. When I first got my bike oil had migrated from the driveshaft to the final drive. All I did was use a small syringe to put it back where it belonged and several oil changes later it's never moved again at least not in any significant quantity. Of the gearbox driveshaft and final drive all using the same oil only the gearbox is highly critical in terms of maintaining an exact oil level so generally depending on where the oil is moving from and to and in what quantity and given it's a quick job to check the levels it may not always worth a major maintenance job to put it right. On the other hand if you continue loose a lot of oil from the gearbox the seal will have to be replaced. Rob's right about the gearbox output flange being the hard part. That would scare me off the task unless I thought it was really necessary.

Last thought did you change oil type or viscosity.

« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 03:49:18 AM by bhodgson »
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline Rob Valdez 79 R65

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Re: oil on the move
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2010, 05:45:01 AM »
Quote
Might worth checking the hole is clear in the gearbox breather/battery lead earth bolt before any major undertaking.
This is a specialized fastener with a small hole down the axis.

Sometimes previous owners replace them with a larger screw with no hole, because they stripped the threads.
If that were the case, I would see about getting a machinist to bore a hole, rather than messing with a timesert type thread repair.  More than likely this is not the cause, however.  Good call, Barry.

Quote
Oil moving around between the transmission assemblies is not that uncommon on airheads. When I first got my bike oil had migrated from the driveshaft to the final drive. All I did was use a small syringe to put it back where it belonged and several oil changes later it's never moved again at least not in any significant quantity.

Barry, did your bike sit for a while before you aquired it?  It's possible the seals dried up and then repaired themselves to a degree after getting back in service. ?

Quote
Last thought did you change oil type or viscosity.

Several years ago I switched to full synthetic for my gear lube needs.
My bike is so messy it's hard to tell if I had any new leaks.  :P
Actually, my final drive has been leaking a lot, last the bike was running.  Dry on the inside, though.  Let's not go there.  Stay on track.
I put the synthetic in there for smoother shifting.  I can't honestly say I noticed much change.  I kept using it because I read it was more durable for gearbox use, less prone to molecular breakdown.  NO, I am not a chemist.

Offline Barry

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Re: oil on the move
« Reply #4 on: February 27, 2010, 06:34:26 AM »
Quote
Barry, did your bike sit for a while before you aquired it?
Indeed it did.
It had only covered 6200 miles in 28 years and very few miles in the last 2 of those years so it is  possible the seals dried up and then repaired themselves.


Don't know if you have read this Chris. Duane Ausherman says a bad gearbox seal lets oil go from the driveshaft to the gearbox and not the other way around ?

http://w6rec.com/duane/bmw/oil.htm
« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 08:23:51 AM by bhodgson »
Barry Cheshire, England 79 R45

Offline Semper Gumby

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Re: oil on the move
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2010, 09:01:54 AM »
Well if you overfill the drive shaft (put 150cc - this is what the book calls for!!!), drive shaft oil will migrate to the tranny through the breather hole at the top when you get to speeds in excess of 60 mph (?) for long periods of time.  This is why I only put about 100cc in the drive shaft.

I have heard that Oak says that the drive shaft will be fine with as little as 50cc in it.  I'm not willing to go that far though.

So if gear oil is moving from the tranny to the drive shaft then it is Seal replacement time.   :P

Curious - what is the oil level in the final drive look like?

« Last Edit: February 27, 2010, 09:03:30 AM by Semper_Gumby »
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chris_blake

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Re: oil on the move
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2010, 05:20:17 AM »
thanks everyone not sure what to do just yet its the same gear oil i always use . the level in the swingarm was so full it came out of the filler hole on removal of the cap might just keep an eye on the gearbox level for now am a bit worried about blowing the seal to drive shaft and swingarm now if the level in swingarm is at max