1983 R65 front bearing pre-load

[rustedframe]

I'm putting an '83 R65 back together.  I wanted to check the preload on the front and rear bearings before I reinstalled the wheels.  I cleaned the bearing and they looked fine to me.  The races looked good and when I spun the bearing in the races with a little oil there was no crunchiness - very smooth.  No odd marks on the races, etc..  The rollers look clean. I figured I'd reuse the old bearings since they looked ok.

So, I used Snowbum's preload method on the rear.  It went fine.  I had to sand the wedding ring just a little to get a nice reading.  That went well.

But on the front, wow - no preload at all. And a lot of slop - like 1-2mm.  So, I put the wedding ring on a lathe and kept reducing.  I started with about 7.1mm (which seemed way too big).  I got to 5.5mm and stopped.  The slop is a lot less, but it's still there.  And there is no drag whatsoever.  But I have say, the bearings feel fine - really good - with just a little 30W on them.  I had a "neutral 3rd party" look at them - we both agreed they looked fine.  And he's a mechanical engineer.

So.  what to do.  I could keep reducing the wedding ring.  Or, I could pull the outer races and press in new bearings.  But I'm curious, has anyone else seen this on an '80s-sh R65?  Do the bearings wear to the point where a 5.5mm wedding ring won't provide any preload?  or am I totally doing it wrong?

I've pressed a lot of bearing into race cars (VW FAG bearings), so I know what a worn bearing acts like.  These don't seem that worn.  And the rears loaded up perfectly.  So I'm wondering if I've got something wrong.  I may try removing the wedding band entirely, just to see if I can get the bearings to load up at all.

It's odd, after each "shaving", they would feel like they were tightening up nicely and then after a few spins they would get real loose again.  (why do I think that's a sign from above? lol.  see joke below.).

Just curious what others think.  I read somewhere that someone else had shaved their front wedding ring mercilessly and had gotten no preload.  (man, that seems like the makings of a really bad joke - don't get me started on wedding rings - color me cynical)

I may just order new bearings.  I ordered the nice shim kit from cycleworks.  I guess I'm gonna take the full "preload ride", but in the end, it will be worth it.  Just curious what others think.

Brad

[Justin B.]

I have never had to mess with this when just cleaning/packing existing bearings.  Was this apart when you started?

[georgesgiralt]

Hello,
IMHO, your front wheel has been poorly serviced sometime ago. One or both bearings have their outer races not sitting in their bore. Maybe a shaving from a ham fisted removal prevent them to seat.
If it was my bike, I'll buy a pair of new bearings, remove the old ones, inspect and repair the hub and install new one.
I replaced my wheel bearing because of rust on my bike. Bearings are so precisely made these days that I did not have to change the preload at all. So either the bearing are poor Chinese copy or they are not seating at all.
Just my 2¢

[Barry]

I don't see how there could have been nearly 2mm of play and the bearings are still good so there is something amiss in the assembly.  Is it possible someone has used the Duane Ausherman type thin shims in the past and there is still one or more in there. They can be hard to see.  Other than that it as to be outers not fully seated as Georges suggests.  A long hard look at it should reveal the problem.

I think your idea of a trial assembly without the wedding band is a good one. 

[rustedframe]

Well.  I learned something.  I took the wedding band out, and the tube, and it acted the same - about 1 mm of play.   Then I got suspicious.

I discovered that with the 1.5" spacer (as per Snowbum's technique) was in place, and using the stock washer under the nut, the washer is smaller than the axle width and so, it kept the nut from applying pressure to the bearings.

So, it seems, I had never been apply real pressure to the bearings - just a small amount before the washer stopped the nut.

I removed the washer, move the 1.5" round spacer to the other side and added in the normal "on the axle" small spacer between the top hat and the nut.  Suddenly all the play came out and the bearings tightened up.

So it appears I shortened my wedding band way way too much.  Good thing I ordered a new 7.1mm ring :-)

Sorry to bother everyone.  But a good lesson when checking bearing preload - make sure the nut isn't being stopped when the washer come up against the end of the axle.  I wonder if that's what the other guy who complained about this did as well...

[dogshome]

That would do it :-)

My friend has had several airheads, he says he hasn't had to re-shim at all when doing bearings. That ties up with the one time I replaced my (slightly rusty) front ones. All loaded ready with shims and it measured just on the bottom limit without them - which according to SB is the right place i.e. factory settings a bit on the hard side. Certainly my steering was much improved. I didn't detect any play but knew there was a little marking on them. Radar-tabs MOT man heard them by spinning the wheel. Yeah, that's a Yellow Bellied Seer Sucker, male, about 2lbs 1oz, has been feeding on pine nuts, sitting on a dead branch, calling to his mate from an ash tree 2KM away.......

[mrclubike]

If you have a lathe you should make adapter sleeves to preload the bearing without mounting it in the fork
That way you can get a good feel of the preload by spinning it with your fingers
I use my Marc Parnes wheel balancing adapters with a bolt run run thru it to preload the stack   
http://www.marcparnes.com/BMW_Motorcycle_Wheel_Balancer.htm#BM17

[mrclubike]

Hello,
IMHO, your front wheel has been poorly serviced sometime ago. One or both bearings have their outer races not sitting in their bore. Maybe a shaving from a ham fisted removal prevent them to seat.

If this would have been the case the preload would have been to tight not loose