The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
Technical Discussion => Discussion about "Lesser" makes, er, Non-BMW ;-) => Topic started by: Diesel_Dave on February 01, 2007, 01:19:57 PM
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Rumours keep raising their heads in europe about BMW developing a diesel motorcycle.
No secret spyshots have been forthcoming so I don't know if this will be a boxer or a K type configuration.
BMW certainly have the tech expertise in the car division, indeed there was some crossover on the F650 development from the M series car type combustion chamber.
Here's a bike to whet you apetites - R45 based:
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg171.imageshack.us%2Fimg171%2F5326%2Fr45dieselcm7.th.jpg&hash=0a7313631cf3205bfd7abcc79e6d56e6a9eddcbf) (http://img171.imageshack.us/my.php?image=r45dieselcm7.jpg)
There you are then, something slower than an R45 ;D
Currently one of the best diesel engines fitted into a bike is the 800cc Smart Car 3 cylinder turbo diesel unit developed by Damler Benz - unfortunately the price comes out to over GBP12k (USD20k+) and the bikes are still in development. A test bike did prove itself capable of 1 litre per 100km at 100kph which I make out to be 282 mpg (Uk gallon) but I guess this must be downhill with the throttle shut.
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg58.imageshack.us%2Fimg58%2F9455%2Fr80rsmartcdiyd1.th.jpg&hash=80e0e64d6ab7e7948a188e9f2b88e0d9c0909b6b) (http://img58.imageshack.us/my.php?image=r80rsmartcdiyd1.jpg)
Another favorite engine is the Lupo 1.2 diesel as this weighs in under 90 kilo's and provides about 60bhp, this is another 3 cylinder unit and developed by the Volkswagen Audi group so easily available to BMW if they wished it.
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg169.imageshack.us%2Fimg169%2F1110%2Fthunderstar1xi8.th.jpg&hash=19d26d5f453f7b06e7d8aa557e92df49373bb6e7) (http://img169.imageshack.us/my.php?image=thunderstar1xi8.jpg)
So far the only mainstream manufacturer to put out a factory diesel motorcycle was Royal Enfield with their mighty 325cc 6HP Greaves engined Bullet - capable of only 45mph but good for 200mpg (Uk) - I know 'cos I have one although it's got a 360cc motor installed. - This bike has to be the most rugged bike ever made and so long as you can kick start the 18.5:1 compression then there is little to stop it running I would choose this bike to do a 'Long Way Round' journey as it would handle the Mongolian 'Road of Bones' easily - mine also has a 4.5 Gallon fuel tank so it has a range of 780 miles! For those doubters about doing long journeys on slow bikes I have toured a lot on this little bike - named Sluggy because of his speed, colour and pugnacious appeal. We have been to Germany where we exited the ferry in Holand at 08:30am and I didn't put a foot down 'till I arrived in the campsite 4.5 hours and 210 miles later - I was glad of the old friction throttle grip. Also made all the ride outs and the return journey without needing to fill up. He also runs quite happily on Veg oil (used or new) home made biodiesel, and even his own used engine oil although this did seem a bit cruel.
This is Sluggy in his small tank days:
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg409.imageshack.us%2Fimg409%2F5958%2Fsluggyfromanarchysarticdd7.th.jpg&hash=be468821cf8c20d9fbdcde8a9d14902056bf9407) (http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sluggyfromanarchysarticdd7.jpg)
I'll be back in Germany for this years diesel bike rally in Sept so I'll catch up on the local gossip then
Regards
Dave
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You can kick over a motor with 18.5:1 compression ratio?! That's a cool bike. Is there much torque with that motor? I always thought that was a diesel motor's strong point, though I know little about them.
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Diesels are all torque unless you add a turbo.
The redline is 3600 rpm and max torque is 2200, this means lots of gear changes.
For the small back lanes in the UK this is perfect though?
Dave
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How is "Sluggy" as far as vibration is concerned ? Can you use your rear view mirrors ? do your
hands & feet go numb ? I would guess that there is probably a fair amount of low frequency vibration,
but possible of significant amplitude, perhaps like a Harley-Davidson ? Is there an oil cooler on Sluggy ?
The 1 liter, 3-cylinder diesel engine in my Kubota 4WD tractor smooths out nicely when it is warm, but I suspect
that it has a counterbalancer, too. It only has 22 HP, but at least 55 lb-feet of torque at 2000 RPM.
Diesels are indeed all about torque and lots of gears - though my tractor has a hydrostatic transmission.
That engine is probably too heavy for practical use in a motorbike.
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You can kick over a motor with 18.5:1 compression ratio?! That's a cool bike. Is there much torque with that motor? I always thought that was a diesel motor's strong point, though I know little about them.
If it "kicks back" you will be "launched" into the lext parking spot or have you leg broken in one or more places.
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Yup, kick starting is a challenge, and you certainly know when it kicks back but no broken bones so far. :o
It does teach you how to kick start a bike though, a 500cc petrol single is a piece of cake afterwards ;)
As for vibes - yes it does vibrate a bit, these early first generation engines don't have the balancer shafts that the new Hatz and Lonbardini motors do. My intention is to get a new Hatz IB50 when the factory releases it with hydraulic tappets and glow plug for winter starting. This motor should bring Sluggy into the 65 mph bracket so motorways become a viable option.
I did try fitting a 400cc barrel and piston without rebalancing the crank; as the piston weighed a third more than the old one the vibes were terrible. It even broke a handlebar casting because it made the mirror waggle about so much.
Now if I could locate a boxer diesel.............
Regards
Dave
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There is a diesel military version of the Kawasaki KLR 650. Supposed to be a civilian version soon, would be an awsome adventure bike. Almost bought the gas version but found my r65 instead.
http://www.gizmag.com/go/4272/
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What year frame is Sluggy? Nice looking bike.
They guys in the 2nd photo must have had an entire team working on that fuel tank, though...
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Didn't Enfield India do a diesel version of the Bullet at some point?
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yep thang is right about the enfeild, there are a couple companies in the EU that are doing something with diesel. i know some guys at another forum that built diesel bikes. one was even envormental minded and ran it on used corn oil, he said it smelled like a french fry. ;D
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That's all I need, riding something that smells like food making me hungry all the time...
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Actually Justin, unless you're stopped at an intersection, it will be all the riders BEHIND you that will
have a constant attack of the munchies - I guess that most bio-fuel diesel riders probably get put at the back of the pack !
;D
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Noticed this interesting R80RT diesel bike conversion in recent publication:
http://www.popularmechanics.com/home_journal/workshop/4219681.html?series=27
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Here's a link to some fun diesel bikes, even a BMW or two!
http://www.dieselbike.net/hatz.htm
some good ideas for the ultimate "GS" winter project........ ;)
mark fitzsimons
1982 R65
1984 R65
1981 R100RT
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Looks like a French exporting company is now selling rebuilt DIESEL Royal Enfields from India ?
I wonder if the small, new Royal enfield bike dealerships in the USA will start carrying these diesel
engine bikes, or offer them as factory options/kits ?
It may be slow, but one could probably commute on it around town for the better part of a month on a tank
of recycled French Fry oil... :)
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ROYAL-ENFIELD-500cc-DIESEL-1965-CANADA-offer-Bullet-DIESEL_W0QQitemZ150157993584QQihZ005QQcategoryZ50024QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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Looks like they are 325 cc 6.5 bhp, and not exactly the greatest looking motorcycle. The other Royal Enfield bikes looked classic, the diesel almost looks like it has a Briggs and Stratton garden tractor engine on it.