The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
Technical Discussion => BMW Technical Q&A, Primarily R65 => Topic started by: samc on July 21, 2008, 10:53:56 AM
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I suspect a hole in my driveshaft boot; chocolate milkshake instead of oil in the shaft housing. This job looks like a royal PITA, and according to the info on IBMWRA, is. Anybody have any advice, shortcuts, etc to offer?
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If you have pulled your transmission you have the idea. You can just remove the swingarm off the bike to change the boot. You can change without removing the swingarm but can cut the new boot trying to move it past the drive shaft flange when it is unbolted for the transmission.
Don
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It requires patience, but just keep telling yourself "This is not impossible to do".
Probably recommended that you get new drive shaft bolts before you start, though some folks claim to re-use theirs with the addition of
a bit of non-permanent LockTite. I am a "use new bolts" advocate, myself.
Put the bike on the centerstand.
Remove your panniers - if you have them. Undo the clamp at the back of the transmission that holds on the front part of the boot and slide the boot back so you can see the attachment bolts holding on the drive shaft coupling and transmission output flange. Locate that small, thin 12-point closed-end wrench from your toolkit for undoing the driveshaft coupler bolts. Put the bike in gear and step on the rear brake pedal - this should hold things solidly enough to loosen each of the bolts. Now, I have never replaced the boot without also having the swingarm bolts removed so that I could push the swingarm back, it might be possible to do without undoing the swingarm, but I haven't done it myself. To get the swingarm to slide back, disconnect the rear brake actuating lever, loosen (but don't remove) the upper shock absorber bolts, and pry off the plastic caps from the swingarm pivots. you will need a thin-walled 27mm socket to get in to loosen the locknuts on the swingarm pivot bolts. Before you undo the swingarm, measure the spacing on the inside edge of the frame and swingarm tube ends - this is so that you can get the swingarm back on there properly centered - I'd recommend using something with better precision than a tape measure, but this picture gives you an idea, anyhow - measure both sides.
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi159.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Ft138%2Fnhmaf%2FDSCN0870.jpg&hash=c846103cf5e7ba7c20020c0bce5b8400b000fa67)
Be sure that you "block up" the bike with some pieces of wood or something under the engine sump, and I use a jackstand that I place
under the crossmember at the lower rear part of the frame, behind the transmission. These keep the bike from tipping front or back while
you've got the swingarm partially disconnected and allow you to swing it to the rear to provide clearance to remove the old boot and install a new boot aththe drive shaft/transmission coupling.
Some thin walled 27mm sockets can be found at auto parts stores or maybe Sears that will fit without modification, but often one has to at least grind off the rounded edge of the socket for it to fit securely in the swingarm pivot housing - you don't want to bugger up the locknut.
BMW sells a special tool for this if you don't have it in your toolkit, or you can find a socket on your own and grind it down if needed, or there are folks on the internet (Ed Korn, among others) who sell modified sockets for this purpose.
So, loosen those 27mm locknuts and then use the Allen key in your toolkit to remove the swingarm bolts/pivot pins. You can then
push the swingarm toward the back - it will pivot on the upper shock absorber bolts that you loosened, and you can stick in a 2x4 piece of wood between the front of the rear tire and the fender to keep it held back (bungee it in place to it doesn't fall out while you have your fingers in a potential "crush zone" installing the rubber boot). you should then have enought clearance to get the old boot off and new boot on without cutting the new boot. You may want to use new clamps, or re-use your old ones if they are in good shape.
Clean and regrease the swingarm bearings while you have the pivot bolts out, and reinstall things basically in the reverse order. You want to set the preload on the swingarm bearings per BMW's instructions, but make sure that you have the swingarm centered properly (using those measurements you took earlier) before you set the bearings. Don't forget to re-tighten the shock absorber mounting bolts when you are through !
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On the subject of bolts, the "experts" are pretty much divided on the subject. The most reasonable thing I have read (and follow myself) is that if you pull a 'shaft and it has the older style bolts with washer - replace 'em. If you have the newer style bolt that does not require a washer then clean, Loc-Tite, and reinstall. I've never had any problems following the "second" school of thought.
About the only thing I differ on with the above procedure is the use of feeler gauges instead of a tape measure or ruler. I build up a stack of feelers and when your stack fits the same on both sides you have "that" part centered. I don't know if it needs to be this precise but to me is pretty easy as I don't have to find my specs to read the rule!
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I actually use a set of dial calipers - have a couple sets around the house for both engineering jobs and for reloading.
I think that they work the quickest/best - I wouldn't really recommend a tape measure unless that is the only thing
one has available. It was more to indicate that measuring is important !
The new bolts that I installed the last time I had mine apart were the washerless type. I think that as long as they thread back in easily
(threads haven't been significantly stretched) they may be reusable w/ Locktite.
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Of all the things I have to do on the BMW, the drive shaft boot is th most fusterating. I usually end up cursing engineers in general.... I use the shorter bolts without the washers also with a little blue locktite. I have a special twelve point wrench that I have filed down so as to be able to get in this tight space.
I hate the boot only because you have succeded in doing everything else and you should be really happy and then you realize that there is that G#WD D#MN B%^T to put back on and you see that the rest of your afternoon is spoiled. >:(
Caveat Emptor.
It could also be a bad boot on the end of the speedo cable or even water entering through the trip odometer push-to-reset button in the glass of the speedo and working its way down the same speedo cable past the perfectly good boot at the bottom. Pick your poison....
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I haven't had to do it on my R65 yet (so perhaps I shouldn't post but I will anyway) but on the R60 you can remove teh rear wheel and loosen (or remove) the final drive to get room to move the driveshaft back enough to slide the boot through the space from the drive shaft to the transmission output flange. That way you don't have to worry about re-centering the swingarm or getting the correct 27mm socket. Still not an easy job but doable. YMMV
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Hmmm, never thought of that...
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Good stuff here. I don't see any damage to the boot, and I wasn't aware that the speedo cable could dump water into the shaft housing; there was no water in the transmission oil, which was where I though the speedo cable would dump to. I packed the cable fitting with heavy grease when I got the bike (this is a common problem on Urals, too), so maybe that fixed it. Or not; I'll know in a while.
Either pulling the FD back or pulling the whole swingarm back seems easier than fighting the boot (if I still need to do that) past the flange; good advice.
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If you don't have water in the tranny them the speedo boot is not the cause.Check your final drive, if ridden in very wet conditions or through deep standing water maybe some water got into the final drive and "migrated" into the drive shaft tupe...
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Sam,
If I recall correctly, you bought your bike relatively recently, may I suggest, if you are going to replace the driveshaft boot, take the extra time, and remove the transmission to do a cleaning ,inspection and relube of the transmission input shaft splines.
We have a member here, NHMAF, that had a low mileage LS (15,000 miles), and had the splines on the transmission wore out and failed.
Cost for this is a transmission overhaul, somewhere in the area of around $5-600, and the transmission shaft itself, in the $300 range.
Or purchase a used transmission .
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Hey, I am renowned and famous !
:D
Here is a link to the thread of my tale of woe:
http://suraklyn.com/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1177891891/0#0
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no water in final drive or transmission; there was water in the shaft only. Sounds like boot again, no? Also sounds like a good winter job; pull the swingarm, slide (ha!) transmission back and lube the splines, etc etc.
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Hmm, I don't ever recall someone having water in the drive shaft tube before, very strange. I wonder if the PO had ridden through deep water with a loose boot clamp or something...