The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
General Category => Chit-Chat => Topic started by: wxp on August 02, 2009, 11:55:02 AM
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Anyone know of a good place to purchase some rear shocks for a r65, 1980 model??
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This definitely is the right forum to ask that question! There's a lot of expertise here, both basic preferences and specialized topics such as lowering an R65 for smaller riders by installing shorter shocks. We spend a lot of time discussing shocks; in fact, I plan to put a question about shocks onto the Technical Forum today.
There are a lot of opinions about shocks, but all of the experienced R65 riders seem to agree on one subject—avoid OEM shocks marketed by BMW.
A number of our members like the British Hagon shocks, sold here in the US through www.davequinnmotorcycles.com. Hagons are especially popular among members wishing to lower their bikes. They're very helpful, to the point of extensively interviewing a customer in order to provide the best fid and ride; I talked with them yesterday on the phone. You'll read things here like "good performance and comfort at a reasonable price) (currently $218/pair for twin-shock models such as your 1980).
If you're familiar with Koni automotive shocks, the Koni design for motorcycles is still available under the Ikon name. (Koni sold its bike-shock rights to an Australian company.) I currently have Konis on my bike. I like their ride and handling a lot. You'll find Ikons to be pricier, though by no means the most expensive airhead shocks on the market.
Good luck with your search!
John
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Also a popular BMW twin shock, 13-inch length
http://www.progressivesuspension.com/productline.html
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I installed Hagons on my R65 and couldn't believe the difference in handling. They get my vote for best value for the money. My R90/6 has Progressive shocks and it handles very well although just a little stiffer. Probably set up for carrying luggage.
Don't neglect taking care of your forks (phorqs?) too after you make the shock fix. Some folks find all kinds of gunk and crud, especially if the oil hasn't been changed in a good while.
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While we're on the subject—What I just learned might help someone, and someone out there might be able to answer a question in my mind. I called Dave Quinn Motorcycles yesterday morning about Hagons.
The rep (I think it was Dave Quinn, though he didn't ID himself) told me what Montmil just posted—standard length for BMW twin shocks is !3" extended. DQ can help with nearly any variable except rear wheel-rear fender clearance. That, the buyer must find.
According to DQM, the 13" shock compresses to 10.0" (piston travel is 3.2"). Hagon makes shocks with extended lengths of 12.6", 12.2", and 11.8", all with piston travel of 3.2". Thus, it's possible (fender clearance issues permitting) to mount an 11.8" shock on an R65, thereby lowering the rear of the bike slightly less than 1.25" If I can do that, I'm happy; I think lowering my bike 1.2" gives me more than enough additional inseam. (I want to avoid reducing piston travel if I can. Though possible, each additional length reduction below 11.8" requires an equal reduction of piston travel.)
Now come the hard questions: Lacking a helper and an inside caliper to measure wheel-fender clearance, I had to improvise. Using a yardstick and a try-square ruler and its level, I measured the bike's wheel & fender with bike on center stand no load on shocks, rear wheel on ground. From ground to top inside of fender is 31.5". From ground to top of tire (120/90x18") is 26.5". Thus, clearance with no load is 5". One additional measurement will permit indirect computation of clearance with rider (Ich) mounted: Distance from ground to bottom edge of fender @ apogee of the arc is 27".
With a helper, I''ll make an additional measurement: (1) Bike off stand, rider mounted, measure distance from ground to lower lip of fender at highest point. Subtract from 27", then subtract that remainder from 5" loaded clearance found above. The result should be loaded wheel-fender clearance. I suspect I'm OK.
Out of characters. More to come. JT
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Could you not use a piece of that green, dense florist foam carved to sit on the top of the rear wheel and touching the inner fender surface; then test load the bike?
Remove the crushed foam and measure the new wheel to loaded bike/fender clearance. Crude, yes, but likely close enough for gub'ment work.
Just an idea... Monte
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Reply #2 (See my previous posting.)
The Dave Quinn Motorcycles person said something interesting to me yesterday. He told me about a customer with a BMW airhead (standard twin-shock length 13") who installed 11.8" Hagons on his bike. The customer gave DQM feedback that it improved both comfort and handling of the bike significantly. Most interesting was what the guy said about how the change affected the rear geometry of his bike. According to the DQM person, the customer said that the shorter shocks reduced the angle of the bike's drive train components, thus (at least theoretically) reducing wear on the drive spline and possibly extending its life. Can someone evaluate the validity of that assertion? It's far beyond the limits of my expertise.
JT
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Very elegant technique, Monte! Definitely a possibility.
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I wouldn't think any "splines" would be affected but it might be easier on the U-joint. But, I thought the R65 had a 12.5" shock opposed to a 13 on the "standard" bikes?
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I like the price on the Hagons compared to the Ikons and they look good too!
My problem is I'm tall 6'3" and dont really want to lower anything if I can help it..
Is it possible that my worn out Boge shocks are already riding lower than a new shorter hagons?
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The condition of the spring, will determine how high or low the bike is sitting .
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The springs may have compressed somewhat over the years. You could always ride with some kind of "butt pad" to get a little extra length. A lot of us use one anyhow for longer rides.
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I just measured my old OEM shocks on the LS. 13 inches exactly to answer Justin's query. The old/new konis are 13 1/8". That is centre bolt top to centre bolt bottom.
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Yep, I measured mine too and it is a perfect 13"?
I'm gonna sit on it and measure later tonight.
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I like the price on the Hagons compared to the Ikons and they look good too!
My problem is I'm tall 6'3" and dont really want to lower anything if I can help it..
Is it possible that my worn out Boge shocks are already riding lower than a new shorter hagons?
I heard (back in the pre-internet days) that the shocks on most airheads were worn out before they ever hit the streets.
Something about being compressed in the shipping crates for so long.
I don't know how accurate any of that is, but I know I waited about 20 years TOO LONG to replace mine. (Hagon)
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My problem is I'm tall 6'3" and dont really want to lower anything if I can help it..
Is it possible that my worn out Boge shocks are already riding lower than a new shorter hagons?
I apologize if I misled you. According to the web site, Hagon's twin shocks (standard) come in lengths varying in 10mm increments from 280mm (8.6") to 350mm (13.8"), and range at more irregular intervals up to 420mm (16.5") and down to 255mm (10.0"). Thus, your height should not deter you from Hagons. (I can't say how long a shock the R65 will take; doubtless, Dave Quinn's can answer that.)
Regarding "stock" length. My bike currently has nonstock 12.75" Konis on it (Stop salivating, Yikes—I haven't replaced them yet. ;D ), and they're a skosh too long for me. A pity, for I really like the ride. In fact, I'm wavering a bit since I installed the '83 center stand, which solved a number of my problems.
John
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Hey thats good news!
I was thinking about a set of ikons but the hagons have definatly caught my eye!
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Thanks for the "real" measurements of the shocks, go4es to show you can't believe everything you hear... :P I would have measured myself but I have no Airheads with factory shocks! ;D
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My rears are rock hard, got no idea what they are, but they're 'orrible!
Fronts are all soggy because stanchions are pitted. I did fit new seals and it helped a bit.
I need budget rear shocks and I'm considering fitting a complete front end from some other bike ... any ideas as to what might be a straight forward swap?
That way I might get decent brakes, better handling and maybe even grow to like my bike.
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Hey, Steve
For my R65s, I buy plug wires, caps and harness wire connectors from an outfit in Florida that specializes in the Yamaha XS650... aka, the Japanese Bonneville.
Mike offers some very economical Dual Progressive spring shocks for the Yammerhammer that, when coupled with his Shock Spacer & Rubber Set, Part #06-3734, might work out on your R65.
Shock lengths are 324mm (12.750 inch) and 335mm (13.189 inch).
$79.00USD/pair. Sharp looking bits but I've no knowledge of the shocks performance or shipping costs to SA.
http://www.mikesxs.net/products-18.html#products
Monte
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"I installed Hagons on my R65 and couldn't believe the difference in handling. "
Hey Begnt, what you notice different about your bike compared to pre Hagon?
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...how does the quote box work....sorry this is my first forum...
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Ampy, Just punch the "quote" button at top-right in the response you wish to quote. It will open a new response window and you can then enter your own response.
You can also hi-light and delete parts of lengthy quotes that that are not pertaining to your response.
Monte
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Ampy, Just punch the "quote" button at top-right in the response you wish to quote. It will open a new response window and you can then enter your own response.
Did this work?
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I get no nifty box around the quote?
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[*quote author=3220243620297574450 link=1249232102/24#24 date=1249435940]I get no nifty box around the quote?[*/quote]
Ampy, the above is what you should see in the box you're typing in (without the *), then you'll see this if you hit the Live Preview...
I get no nifty box around the quote?
You need to be sure and start typing after the last [ /quote] for your response to be outside the box.
Make sense?
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Earlier this year I bought a set of "replica" shocks from Bob's BMW for my '83 R65, the ones with the levers, etc. Honestly I am not impressed despite the over $300 cost (after shipping). I don't think the bike rides any better than with the old stockers that were on it! Very harsh ride. I can feel almost any and every disturbance in the road surface. They look nice, but......I wouldn't recommend them to anyone. If I had my money back I'd try something else.
:'(
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[*quote author=3220243620297574450 link=1249232102/24#24 date=1249435940]I get no nifty box around the quote?[*/quote]
Ampy, the above is what you should see in the box you're typing in (without the *), then you'll see this if you hit the Live Preview...
I get no nifty box around the quote?
You need to be sure and start typing after the last [ /quote] for your response to be outside the box.
Make sense?
If this works it makes sense!
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Awe shucks! I'm dangerous now!
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Earlier this year I bought a set of "replica" shocks from Bob's BMW for my '83 R65, the ones with the levers, etc. Honestly I am not impressed despite the over $300 cost (after shipping). I don't think the bike rides any better than with the old stockers that were on it! Very harsh ride. I can feel almost any and every disturbance in the road surface. They look nice, but......I wouldn't recommend them to anyone. If I had my money back I'd try something else.
:'(
Now that I've learned to quote...I assume these are the Progressive brand?
If so I've read several posts referring to their stiff ride?
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I get no nifty box around the quote?
Amps, You oughta get this. Monte
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Hey Begnt, what you notice different about your bike compared to pre Hagon?
The Hagons are much firmer in the corners. The old ones felt pretty mushy. At 245 lbs I have more than my share of avoirdupois so the firmer shocks helped. When I ordered Dave Quinn took a lot of time asking questions about how I ride and what I wanted to do with the bike. I went with his recommendations and have not been disappointed. I'd buy again without any hesitation, especially considering the price.
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avoirdupois
Now I had to look that one up! ;) Pretty weighty words there, Bengt.
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See how mind expanding this site can be? ;D
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IMHO, it may not be Mike's mind that is expanding.
"When I ordered, Dave Quinn took a lot of time asking questions about ...what I wanted to do with the bike."
I wanta ride the bike to more BBQ joints, sez the Mikester. No... Don't cut the fat off that brisket!
Luv ya, Mike. I'm just a little bummed out 'cause you're getting to go on a neat BMW-crew ride this weekend while I get to entertain two little grandchildren. Females. Four and seven years old. Active.
I'm exhausted already. [smiley=zzz.gif] Monte
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avoirdupois
Now I had to look that one up! ;) Pretty weighty words there, Bengt.
I think it's funny that our name for the metric system is English, but our name for the English system is French.
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I wanta ride the bike to more BBQ joints, sez the Mikester. No... Don't cut the fat off that brisket!
No, don't ever cut the fat off the brisket! I smoke it with the fleece side up so it stays tender & juicy. YOU can cut if off when you eat it.
Luv ya, Mike. I'm just a little bummed out 'cause you're getting to go on a neat BMW-crew ride this weekend while I get to entertain two little grandchildren. Females. Four and seven years old. Active.
Monte, let's get it correct, Sunday is the breakfast ride to Mary's at Tin Top. Saturday afternoon is the annual Bikini Bike Wash at Eurosports but Noooooo! you can't go to either one. (Justin, it's from 2-5 pm with eats, music, and bikini washers.) Like I suggested earlier, you can host your own bikini bike wash in your driveway and have lots of fun with the granddaughters also.
OK, we now return you to the shock absorber thread. I'll try to keep the polysyllabic words to a minimum from now on.
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polysyllabic
You just can't help yourself, can you?
I love it when I learn new non-BMW things on this forum...
I think it's funny that our name for the metric system is English, but our name for the English system is French.
Never thought about that one before...
(And I'm not helping the shock thread, either...sorry!)
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ooooh .... some adroit comebacks!
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Funny how the subject of rider's weight and shocks came up at just the right time! I rode last week & thought it might have been a false impression, but my ride this week confirmed it. With the bike off the cemter stand, and with me on the bike, I'm having more trouble footing the ground with both feet. Until recently, I had no trouble (at least on level ground) flatfooting both feet. Then it occurred to me: the bike might be riding higher on its shocks (me aboard) because I've dropped almost 25 lb. in the past 6 months.
No, anxious ones, I'm not sick. I've taken to the gym at 0600, three days/week, plus I've given up beer in favor of wine for preventive reasons. I had a very painful toe a few weeks ago. The only logical cause was my first gout attack. Standard advice is to avoid alcohol, and especially beer! Not about to do the first—gout is preferable—but the second part of that recommendation gives me some wiggle room. ;) So I guess I'll be in the market for shorter Hagons (11.8" vs. the 12.75" Konis on it at the moment.
Two things give me pause: (1) most important, the cash flow for the next few months. Darling daughter, because of good grades, has succeeded in switching law schools, causing big startup costs in her new citY (Philly), and (2) I still like the Koni ride.
Similar topic: since I got the new (1983) center stand, the bike is harder to get onto the center stand, but much easier to get off it. Lowering the bike by shorter shocks should make the bike even more difficult to muscle onto the center stand. However it should still be easy to nudge off the stand. Sure wish I had paid attention in geometry and physics classes in high school! :-[ :( (Yeah, I know, installing shorter shocks won't help this.)
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Less weight is good! Way to go.
And how much better the Beemer performs. Imagine how many titanium Beemer bits you'd have to buy to carve 25 pounds off the bike. Likely more than the Philly start-up tab...
Monte
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Have you tried changing the preload on the shocks you have? That might make a difference - without having to purchase new shorter shocks. It will change the feel, not quite as soft, but it could help get your feet back on the ground.
That's always what I have to do - even WITH the shorter shocks. :(
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Thanks for the kind words, Monte. And Aida, I think I'm already at the softest setting on the Koni's; I'll try to remember to check the adjuster positions tomorrow.
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I think/thought that the KONIs (and presumable, the IKONs) could be ordered with different 'weight' springs? As they are rebuildable, perhaps a shorter or softer spring might be in order if you could find someone who services these (though I'd be wary of going too soft on the springs - unless you really want to feel like you're riding a 'rubber cow' or cruiser..)
I think that the cheapest solution to both your problems is to just always keep your panniers filled with 12.5 pounds of beer in each side ! :D
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You actually need to make them stiffer - put in all the preload you can to take the height down. It can make for a rough ride at times, but it helps the height. I know, it seems backwards to me, but that's what works...
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From nhmaf: <<I think that the cheapest solution to both your problems is to just always keep your panniers filled with 12.5 pounds of beer in each side !>>
:'( :'( Oh, woe! About a month ago I came down with an extremely painful malady in the big toe of my left foot. After research, I concluded (and my doc concurs) that it might have been my first-ever attack of gout! The literature recommends avoiding alcohol, but contains a particularly stern warning about avoiding beer! :o Seems that beer contains a substance that is especially likely to promote the buildup of uric acid in the blood, a cause of gout). :(
So in the spirit of compromise, instead of heading for the fridge for a beer, I now run downstairs to a dark, temperature-controlled junk room and grab a good bottle of wine. ;D Another good alternative is a glass of Maker's Mark with a single ice cube (to give it flavor). :D
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Seems that beer contains a substance that is especially likely to promote the buildup of uric acid in the blood, a cause of gout).
Me thinks you must be drinking the cheaper stuff...try Coopers Pale Ale - that is the cure for ALL maladys. :P
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Try home-brewed beer, it cures all that ails (ales?) you .
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Just purchased a YSS shock from http://www.wilbersusa.com/
I went through my local BMW dealer in NW Arkansas. Denise is the lady I ordered it through.. The shock has infinite preload adj. and 60 dampening adj..(Alot) After 40 miles of riding I am satisfied with the performance.. [smiley=bmw_smiley.gif]
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Which of the YSS shocks did you get, Scoot? ::)
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Yikes,
I put Model# MZ302-415TR-01.. Says BMW/R80RT '85-'95...
I priced them directly from WilbersUSA. http://www.yssusa.com/series-z.html
They seemed cheaper from the dealer. I don't know if the dealer gets a better price than ordering direct. I am really pleased with the shock after a 100 mile ride of puttin' it to the test on Missouri back roads and riding like a Domino's delivery guy tryin' to get your Pizza to you before the 30 minute deadline! [smiley=bmw_smiley.gif]
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Just found these, after some web searching.
http://www.motocicliveloci.it/inglese/catalogue/ammortizzatori_uk.htm
With price's come up very well on the G.A.Z.I.-01 and the G.A.Z.I.-03 both coming in the 33 cm/13 inches R65 range.
Thought's?