The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
Technical Discussion => BMW Technical Q&A, Primarily R65 => Topic started by: chris_blake on December 10, 2007, 03:20:44 AM
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1986 mono the clutch will not disengage on my bike this has come out of the blue this morning after starting the bike put it in gear almost went through the garage doors checked cable this seems ok ie it is operating the clutch arm removed clutch arm and rubber boot a small amount of water came out of the rubber boot my worry now is the manual says any checks require removal of gearbox is there any thing else i can check ie how can i tell if the clutch arm is moving the clutch pushrod i am just hoping someone out there has had this problem before and solved it without a major teardown of the clutch and gearbox as this is way beyond my mechanical abilities heres hoping
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How much play is there in the cable at the lever? If waaay too much maybe the clutch is not able to disengage all the way? Did this come on all of a sudden or like this after being in storage for a long time? It's not real uncommon for a bike that has been in storage for an extended period of time to have the clutch friction disc actually rust to the flywheel. If you just all of a sudden have gobs of slack and this condition then maybe the throwout bearing assembly/piston has bit the dust.
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If *water* came out of the clutch arm/piston boot then at the very least you should be planning to drain the oil from the transmission and replace it - if it has become contaminated with water (oil will have a creamy/cloudy appearance like coffee with cream) you gotta get that outta there right away or serious transmission damage will result in short order. Most likely cause of getting water into the transmission is through the speedometer cable/boot at the back end of the transmission where the driveshaft is attached.
Good luck, let us know what you find and we can help out with advice or instruction.
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the bike is used every day the clutch cable is fine about 6weeks ago i changed the gearbox oil and it was contaminated with water so i flushed it out i have done about 800 miles since with no probs if the rod or bearing has siezed can i tell this by removing the clutch arm and if so can ido anything to it without astripdown of the gearbox
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You can pull on the hand lever and watch the lever behind the tranny operate. Does it look normal?
You can remove that rear lever and pull out your clutch push rod, which on your bike I believe will be one piece with the throwout bearing and examine those parts. If that all looks OK and your free play adjustment is correct, then I would put it back together and try putting the bike in gear, pulling in the clutch lever, and rocking the bike back and forth trying to free up the clutch disk. I don't know why a dry clutch bike that is ridden every day would have the disk freeze up, though.
My Triumph is a bit prone to that after a longs it. :(
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i cant get a grip on the rod as there is only a small end showing is this normal also i have tried rocking the bike in gear no joy
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my clymer says you must remove the gearbox to remove the pushrod and thrust bearing but i will try any way it is different from the pre 81 but looking at the diagram if i can get something to grip the piston it looks as if the whole assembly will pull out heres hoping anyway i will let you know how it goes and thanks for your help
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The end of the pushrod is threaded for a removal tool, sorry but I don't know the diameter or thread pitch.
So you might be able to get something threaded in there to remove it, and if you bugger up the threads, it won't make a difference, as they are only used for removal of the rod and it will not be detrimental to it's operation.
Hey Justin, by chance have you determined the thread size on your spare pushrod , I mentioned this back in May in one of my threads on my transmission overhaul debacle.
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Sorry, I didn't know they had changed THAT on the later bikes. I thought since our transmissions are noninterchangeable, that the clutch operating stuff would be similar too.
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I went to RealOEM.com parts site, and did a search of '86 monoshock european model R65, and it shows the same clutch control parts used on '81 and later bikes, so I don't think the Clymer manual is correct in this instance.
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Bob, not exactly figured out the thread. The smallest metric screw I have that I'm 100% sure of it's size is an M3.5 and the hole in the rod is a bit smaller than that. So, maybe an M3?
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The Clymer manual states that the transmission needs to be removed to remove the pushrod, I always remove the swingarm/final drive when removing the transmission, that may allow for removal of the pushrod, if you don't do this , there may not be enough room to remove the pushrod, as it may contact the swingarm before being able to extract it.
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Given the length of the rod, I also don't think that one can remove it from the transmission without either removing the transmission from the engine, or else basically removing the swingarm from the frame (I don't think that you can just undo the swingarm pivot bearings and pull it far enough back while leaving the upper shock absorber mounts connected).. I may be wrong, but I don't think so. The last time I had serviced this, I also had the transmission out at the same time (Replacing the clutch disk)..
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sorry its took so long to get back to you busy at work i hope to get to the bike at weekend the manual does not say anything about a special tool does this mean its not needed if the box is dropped looking at the clearance i dont think it will clear the swing arm anyway if all else fails i have 2 weeks off soon guess i will be busy
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The threaded hole in the pushrod is there to aid in removing the pushrod, the pushrod goes through an oil seal about 2-3 inches from the opening that is covered with a rubber 'boot'.
This is what you're pulling against, this and the fact that the pushrod goes all the way through the transmission, inside the input shaft, so there might be some 'grunge' in there as well complicating the removal.
Normally you can grab the pushrod with a pair of pliers, and pull it right out, but it sounds like it's been a long time , if it ever has been removed.
Welcome to the world of old motor vehicles, where a simple 5 minute job turns into a weekend project !!
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good news i sprayed the pushrod and bearing with penetrating oil and it has released i know i wil have to carry out a proper repair but would it be ok to give it another good spray with oil or would spray grease be better if i can get away with this for 2 weeks it would save me a great deal of trouble what do you think thanks again for all your help
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A short time of two weeks won't be harmful, unless you hear or feel something isn't right, I just wouldn't let it go for an extended time before a proper repair is made.
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good news i sprayed the pushrod to help release it and the clutch now works i know this is a job to still do but i was thinking to give it another good spray with penetrating oil [would spray grease be better] and then carry on using the bike for a couple of weeks till i can repair properly what do you think once again thanks for all your advice