The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
Technical Discussion => BMW Technical Q&A, Primarily R65 => Topic started by: AlfromNH on February 13, 2014, 01:52:04 PM
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I have a new set of Bridgestone Battlax BT45s. I have both mounted without much fuss, but I can't get the beads to seat on either. I started with windex, my usual tire mounting lube, and also tried dish soap, both diluted and even straight from the bottle. About 30-45' on each side will not set, on both tires. I've filled each to 60+ psi. >:(
Is this typical for snowflakes? Is there some trick?
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It's not untypical.
More pressure (maybe from a safe distance if that can be contrived) or remove the valve core and inflate the tire real fast from a compressor.
The more pressure and safe distance could be achieved by inflating to 60 psi and then putting it wheel out in the sun if you have such a thing at this time of year. If NH means New Hampshire I guess you don't have much more than we do.
I just bought 2 new tires for mine. There's more than enough tread on my existing tires that I don't need to put them on for a while yet so they are safely tucked away vacuum wrapped in black plastic until the mythical sun returns.
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Sun? It was sunny yesterday, but well below freezing so I guess that's not much help. :(
Yes, I'm in New Hampshire. The one that's experiencing the umpteenth blizzard of the season. >:(
Maybe I'll try a heat gun... :-?
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Some tires may be harder to seat than others. The area where the bead slides on the rim must be very clean, meaning no rough spots or anything else to interfere with seating.
Somewhere there is a maximum pressure to safely put in the tire. Good luck.
Bob
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I have heard of putting a ratcheting tie down around the circumference of the tire and tightening it down, and down.
I have never changed a tire, myself.
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The ratchet method works, although it's usually used on squat tires such as for hand trucks, atv's, or even big old boggers. These tires have a hard time even contacting the rim and thus building up pressure. The ratchet tiedown squeezes the tires out towards the beads. Some folks even ratchet down and then spray ether inside before setting it off!
Be careful if you try using a ratchet tie down. My brother snapped one (of mine) in half when he used it to mount a tire.
The heat gun will help, although I wonder how much uniform heating you can maintain with that method. Setting the wheel near a wood stove or in a warm oven for a while might be easier. Also, you could try getting yourself some genuine tire lube. I bought a gallon jug years ago at NAPA and don't expect to need any more within the next few decades. It was relatively inexpensive.
You could try lubing up the tire really well, inflating it to seating pressure, and then using the heat around the tire. Sometimes they like to sit for a few minutes before they pop into place.
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The tire beads of my Bridgestone Spitfires on my '81 R65 finally seated when I put 100psi in the tires and let 'em sit in the sun for about ten minutes. You'll definitely hear the beads take their seat! BTW, I run 'em tubeless.
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I have heard of putting a ratcheting tie down around the circumference of the tire and tightening it down, and down. I have never changed a tire, myself.
Really only of use when mounting a tubeless tyre. Std snowflakes are not designed for, or approved for tubeless tyres. Yes, thousands of riders in hundreds of countries run them tubeless and experience no problems.
Just saying.......
What???? You have never changed a tyre yourself? You are no true motorcyclist until you have ridden a deflating or flat tyre 20 miles on a dark and stormy night for the sole purpose of finding a street light to use while you get your back wheel out, remove the roofing screw you picked up, dismount the tyre, patch the tube and then get on your way.
It is not a difficult task, Youtube abounds with excellent training videos.
Mind you. I'm nearly 60 now, if the scenario above where to happen now it would out with the mobile phone, call the road-side assistance service I am a member of, and book into the nearest motel to wait for the bike to be fixed. BUT, I know HOW to change a tyre, that's the important thing :-)
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The really important thing is to be sure your cell phone is charged.
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The really important thing is to be sure your cell phone is charged.
I agree. How did we live in the days before mobile phones? Actually I need to fess up that my currently sleeping R100 has, over the years sprouted USB charging points for keeping phones, intercom, GPS,
MPS players charged, I've even fitted the poor thing with a very small and discreet CB radio - the phone, GPS, CB and MP3 player all play nicely with a Scala intercom/phone/mp3 device.
The one problem I do have is trying to manipulate fiddly controls with gloves on. I have found the solution - and have ordered from here as a late Christmas present to myself.
https://www.beartekgloves.com/
They tell me that they can control anything with a bluetooth interface that accepts "standard" remote control instructions. Woo hoo!
"No officer, I was not making a rude gesture at you, I was trying to turn up the volume of "Black Magic Woman" using my bluetooth control gloves." That will be interesting.
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The really important thing is to be sure your cell phone is charged.
I agree. How did we live in the days before mobile phones? Actually I need to fess up that my currently sleeping R100 has, over the years sprouted USB charging points for keeping phones, intercom, GPS,
MPS players charged, I've even fitted the poor thing with a very small and discreet CB radio - the phone, GPS, CB and MP3 player all play nicely with a Scala intercom/phone/mp3 device.
The one problem I do have is trying to manipulate fiddly controls with gloves on. I have found the solution - and have ordered from here as a late Christmas present to myself.
https://www.beartekgloves.com/
They tell me that they can control anything with a bluetooth interface that accepts "standard" remote control instructions. Woo hoo!
"No officer, I was not making a rude gesture at you, I was trying to turn up the volume of "Black Magic Woman" using my bluetooth control gloves." That will be interesting.
Those are very cool gloves! They deserve a thread of their own - not buried in some thread about mounting tires.
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Thanks for all the suggests, guys. My tire chuck is the type with the center pin that needs to be depressed to flow air, so I can't fill the tire without the core. I'm going to get a better chuck today and try tht method.
Another note: I just noticed my rear tire is labelled "BT-45R", the front is simply "BT-45". R doesn't mean radial, does it?
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Another note: I just noticed my rear tire is labelled "BT-45R", the front is simply "BT-45". R doesn't mean radial, does it?
Answered your own question there, so I'll just point it out for you: R = rear.
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This time of year I put my tires in on a shelf of my chimney, which is well-heated by my wood stove. Sometimes I have to displace a cat, as they love those chimney shelves.
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I just went through the same exercise today. It took 130 psi to finally get the front tire (a Heidenau) to bead. Even at 100 psi and in front of a fireplace for a week it would not bead. I used a lot of dish soap...
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I just went through the same exercise today. It took 130 psi to finally get the front tire (a Heidenau) to bead...
:o
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I forgot to mention bouncing it on the floor.
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Ha !
You should have told us it was a Heidenau ! Boy, these tires are hard rubber ! I had a tremendous trouble mounting my front K34 last November ! I ruined two tubes ....
But fortunately, I had no trouble sitting it as I used a lot of proper tire soap (to install it in the first place...)
Glad I'm not alone ... 8-)
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130 psi :'(
I think I'd chicken out long before getting to that point. At the very least I'd be covering the wheel with blankets to absorb the explosion !
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Ha !
You should have told us it was a Heidenau !
I'm the OP, and I'm not mounting Heidenaus, I have Bridgestones.
Anyway, I tried inflating them with the valve cores removed, still no go. :'( I'm going to try some real tire mount lube next I guess.
Rob: I tried bouncing them, also tried a ratchet strap around the circumference. Haven't tried sunshine 'cuz I'm a few months from that being a viable option. :P
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On my 1981 R65, I dis-mounted the old and mounted the new Spitfires all by my lonesome. A bit challenging but did complete the job.
After the nicks n' scratches on my hands had healed, and the entire wasted day was a distant and unpleasant memory, I made a "note to self"... Next time we go with an indy bike shop with proper motorcycle tire mounting equipment.
The R100S' new Spitfires required a simple drop off and pickup. Done. The Triumph Trophy 900 is next in line for new shoes and those tires will be mounted the same way... painlessly.
Another upside to paying for the tire mounting is that should anything go wrong, it's on the shop's dime.
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Success! I can now say from experience that real tire lubricant works better than Windex or dish soap.
All the references to RU-Glyde said to get it at NAPA. what I saw there was a 5 gallon bucket for $65, I had a hard time rationalizing that one. A little more research, and I found it at Pep Boys in a 1 gallon jug for $12. Considering I used about 1/4 cup mounting 2 tires I guess I have a lifetime supply anyway. :P
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Thanks for all the suggests, guys. My tire chuck is the type with the center pin that needs to be depressed to flow air, so I can't fill the tire without the core. I'm going to get a better chuck today and try tht method.
Another note: I just noticed my rear tire is labelled "BT-45R", the front is simply "BT-45". R doesn't mean radial, does it?
The only time you may need to make sure air gets in FAST is if your are trying to get the beads to seat with no tube. I have also had some tires take 100 PSI to seat. You may try deflating the tire, putting some tire lube on the bead, then try seating again.
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Well, that's what I get for not reading the thread all the way to the end! RU-Glide is good stuff...
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I spray WD40 all over it and pump up to 100psi. Then a good wash of the tyres.
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For what it is worth...
Back when I was a R&D engineer at Firestone Tire Co., it was my job to build and test tires made from experimental materials and designs. This required me to test ride hundreds of tires over the years so I spent a lot of time at the Firestone garage having my test tires mounted.
First and foremost, the tires were mounted but not inflated and placed in a steel cage to be inflated with a remote air hose that attached to the valve stem while the technicians moved away to a safe spot to inflate the tire which was bias ply and were only inflated to 26 psi. The material used to facilitate the bead seating was Murphy's soap which I believe is still available.
The general wisdom of the tire engineers was that when a tire is inflated over 80 psi IT BECAME A BOMB! thus the steel gage. One of our indoor test labs was completely destroyed when an aircraft tire on a simulated landing test at approx. 125 psi exploded and took out a concrete block wall which was replaced by bridge grating with explosion pads to reduce the concussion of any future sudden deflation.
Just saying, fellows. Be careful.