The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
Technical Discussion => BMW Technical Q&A, Primarily R65 => Topic started by: Session101 on July 19, 2012, 01:11:28 PM
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Hey guys,
so my R65 is back to life, runs good now and went for her maiden voyage with good results. Let me talk about my troubles a bit then let me ask questions after.
What started as the bike would not stay started for more than 2 mins was just a big mess for months.
Started with fresh re-built carbs, the bike would start and idle and everything for about 2 mins then would just die... I thought i did a great job on the carbs, so i was thinking ignition.
I went out and bought new spark plugs, new points and new condenser. All replaced on the bike, and again started up the bike with same deal.... now im thinking its something else, maybe it is the carbs.
So i was playing around and checked that i majorly didn't adjust the float on the carbs correctly. So now I fixed that, rolled the back back outside and then it just cranked.... and cranked..... and cranked, WTF??? so back to square one. Checking wires and connections that were all good. So i thought the parts i replaced were bad, but instead decided to start from basics. How about check the spark? I pulled the plugs still attached to the wires, tried to fire and no spark! well i was baffled, i checked the points and they are correct gap and making a good connection too. Low and behold i researched and found out that one guy mentioned that you have to be careful on putting the front cover back on. I checked and sure enough the wire that goes from the condenser to the first coil was smashed in between the cover and motor. So i cut it, soldered it back up and turned the ignition and
BAM! I got some spark! Put her all back together and she ran and drove great!
so i have a couple of questions involving the bike
#1 is the brake light supposed to come on with the front brake squeezed or only the back brake?
#2 while the bike is in gear and the turn signal on I have a buzzing noise with the turn signal blinking, yet when i engage the clutch its gone
#3 how can you tell that the choke is correct? i might have messed up and turned it too much on one side because when i start at full choke it idles but if you try to give it gas over 1000 rpm the right side pops and goes back to like an idle of 500
my bike is a 1980 R65
thanks
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Not real sure on the front brake light switch, being an '80 model year bike, I know the '79 model year bikes had a front pressure switch plumbed into the brake hydraulic system under the tank .
If you don't have a switch there, there is a small electrical switch that is threaded into the control perch at the brake lever .
Maybe just a wire off of the switch, or a faulty switch causing the front brake application not to turn the brake light on .
The first generation r65's came with a buzzer to give you an audible warning that the turn directionals were in use .
I don't have a wiring diagram for that circuit, but my guess is, that when the clutch lever is pulled in, the safety interlock switch at the clutch lever causes the buzzer to stop working .
Maybe someone with the correct wiring diagram can confirm this .
The choke assemblies are side specific, a left and right side only application .
When the choke is in the closed position, the arm on the choke should
rest up against a stop cast into the choke housing .
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#1 is the brake light supposed to come on with the front brake squeezed or only the back brake?
On my 79 the brake light works on front and back brakes. The pressure switch is on the splitter just behind the headlight.
#2 while the bike is in gear and the turn signal on I have a buzzing noise with the turn signal blinking, yet when i engage the clutch its gone
Yes that's how it's supposed to work so that you only get the warning beeper on the move. You'll find it's muted in neutral too. If like me you find it too loud put some tape over the beeper diaphragm. I learned to live with it and now consider it a good safety feature as forgetting to cancel an indicator can be a killer.
#3 how can you tell that the choke is correct? i might have messed up and turned it too much on one side because when i start at full choke it idles but if you try to give it gas over 1000 rpm the right side pops and goes back to like an idle of 500
You can adjust the cable clamps at the choke operating arm so that when the lever is operated they both touch the stops at the same time. Engine idle when using the choke isn't wonderful anyway on the early carbs. Expect to have to hold it on the throttle until the engine has warmed up a little.
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so guess what?!? new problems... and they happened when trying to put the bike back to stock
first my tach is not reading right anymore, the needle jumps all over the place sometimes to redline, i have no clue what do do about that, i cleaned the connectors on the tach side and still no luck, it really started doing that under load when i was riding 2 up, now it does it all the time
2nd... im not starting to get random backfire when putting the stock air cleaner system on, and also im getting random shorts while driving, the bike will just cut out then go on, its like im crusing at 3000rpm and then just cuts out, GEN light turns on for a sec then goes back to normal, if i go full throttle then its fine, but i have noticed the bike is more gutless now, any ideas?
the only thing i have done differently is put the stock air cleaner system back on instead of pod filters...
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ok update*
went through every single wire connector and cleaned it off with wire brush and put back together also spraying contact cleaner, and now no more tach problems and no more engine cutting out
so now the only thing that remains is the bike feeling underpowered...
i can hold the throttle down all day long and i don't feel like the bike is getting up to speed at all... i have to go full throttle just to get the bike up to 65mph and almost hold it there and the speedo needle barely moves... what gives?
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Check the rubber diaphragms in the top of the carbs for tears cracks, etc.....
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GENIUS!
sure enough L side carb diaphram was torn, will have to order 2 new ones, i hope its easy enough to replace...
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Order genuine Bing diaphragms for your replacements.
There are others offered but these have been shown to be inferior as the rubber is too thick and does not perform correctly.
If you have flat top Bings with the plastic rings securing the diaphragms, you'll be needing a pan of hot water to remove the ring from the old rubber and again to replace the new. Age may have weakened the plastic. Don't break those rings!
The new diaphragms will likely have a small tab that mates with the carb body to guide correct installation position.
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Sounds like you're going to need a good tuning after you rebuild the carbs and such...
A tune up starts at the Valves... Set the valves first.. Then move on to the carbs.. If the valves aren't right anything you do to the carbs is mute..
Glad you got all your electrical gremlins worked out...
John
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Sounds like you're going to need a good tuning after you rebuild the carbs and such...
A tune up starts at the Valves... Set the valves first.. Then move on to the carbs.. If the valves aren't right anything you do to the carbs is mute..
Glad you got all your electrical gremlins worked out...
John
And in Session's case, points gap and timing.
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i wish there was a video on how to do that, it would be a lot easier to follow rather than read... plus im skeptical to take the covers off and mess something up... looked in the FAQ section and didn't see anything
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i wish there was a video on how to do that, it would be a lot easier to follow rather than read... plus im skeptical to take the covers off and mess something up... looked in the FAQ section and didn't see anything
I don't know how to do it on a BMW, as mine has electronic ignition. The timing hasn't changed in the last 50,000 miles. On my Triumph points are a pain in the neck, but they are easier to get to than on a BMW.
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You have what's called points in a can. It's a very simple and very reliable system but I've seen easier points to get at and adjust. Once the points have been checked or replaced you will have to check the timing. That being the case access to the points is much easier if you remove the whole can and work on the bench.
Disconnect the battery - Very important
Remove the front cover - 5mm Allen key
Mark the alignment of the can and then remove it - 4mm Allen key
Remove the can lid and outrigger bearing - screwdriver
You can then adjust or replace the points. Set the points gap at 18 thou (the precise gap give or take a couple of thou is not critical) and reassemble but Note the gap will change slightly when you replace the outrigger bearing. You can adjust the gap with the bearing plate in place. Access is tight though. Lube the points cam with a little grease and the outrigger bearing with a drop of thin oil. Re-install the can using your alignment marks.
You can do an initial timing check by observing the flywheel S mark is in the timing window and aligns with the notch when the points start to open. Follow that with a strobe check of Z mark which should indicate full advance at 3000+ rpm.
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sry i mean to say a video on how to gap and tighten the valves, i already did the points, that was easy
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Ohhh. Well, never mind.
All the same, thanks for the effort expended, Barry.
Points gap / valve adjustment. Easily confused. [smiley=wall.gif]
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Setting the valves is actually easier!
1. Remove both valve covers.
2. With transmission in fifth and timing hole open, rotate rear wheel to OT (top dead center)
3. One cylinder will have both valve loose. That's the one to adjust first.
4. Check rocker play, that's the shaft that pivots between two head studs. If it's more than .001", loosen one of the head studs and clamp the ends together to eliminate the play.
Torque the head stud back down to 25 ft/lbs.
Then again, you didn't want a write-up, but a video. Problem is, by the time the video equipment gets set up, the adjustment is done. It's really too easy.
Is this your first valve adjust ever?
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yes first ever, so dunno what tools i need and such and really what im looking at
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Got a Haynes or Clymer shop manual nearby, Senor Session? Entire process explained.
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popped the new diaphragms in and its so much better! yeah i have a manual in the garage but i think i video would be best, manuals aren't as great as actually seeing someone doing it, plus the tools, i want to make sure i have them all before i open the valve covers up
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Feeler gauges and two 13MM wrenches, one being open-end. That's it.
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Are you familiar with doing mechanical work? One of the important skills is having a feel for the proper torque for fasteners. Beginners tend to over tighten fasteners and strip out aluminum threads.
If that's the case, it would be best to find someone in your area to show you how it's done and get a feel for the job. These bikes look simple, and besides, how hard can it be loosening and tightening some bolts and nuts? Ask most of us here how a simple job can turn into a week-long nightmare. ;)
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i have a torque wrench if that's what you're asking and i have wrenched some in my day, just don't want to break something that's running and turn it into a week long project like you said
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i have a torque wrench if that's what you're asking and i have wrenched some in my day, just don't want to break something that's running and turn it into a week long project like you said
No torque wrench required for setting valve lash. Only needed if a cylinder head bolt is loosened.