The New And Improved Unofficial R65 Forum V2
Technical Discussion => BMW Technical Q&A, Primarily R65 => Topic started by: Sava66 on May 30, 2012, 04:13:56 AM
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Hello all. As you can see below, my rocker cover needs some attention. I want to swap it out this weekend. I already have a nice set I got for 15 euros from German ebay. The only thing I have so far is this part: 11121338426. I think it is a paper gasket. I am not sure what kind of gasket is in there. Can someone just give me a laundry list of what I need before I take off the valve cover? I heard someone mention silicon gasket glue. Do I need two gaskets? I just don't to take it off, and find out I'm missing something and then I have to wait. It's not leaking now. The way the cover is now, would less air be getting to the engine? is it dangerous to ride like this? Any tips would be appreciated. Thanks.
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Unless there is a physical hole in the valve cover, it's just the cosmetics that thing is hurting. The bike won't mind having a scratch there.
If you really want to remove the covers, you will only need a little tube of liquid gasket and 2 pieces of paper gasket, a single piece for both sides. If the paper gasket is new, it's easily reusable given that you take care of disassembly. If it is old, you may have to replace it.
You will also need a crescent wrench (Size 12 or 13 I think) to remove two nuts at the back of the cover. After removing them, you will need a deep socket wrench to remove the central nut as some normal socket wrenches are too think to fit in that hole. After the removal of the nuts, a couple of soft taps from a rubber mallet should loosen the cover from the cylinder.
When putting the cover back on, remember that those things are Left/Right handed. Just a smear of liquid gasket on the paper gasket and it should ensure leak free operation for a long time.
Just be careful of putting the central nut back on. It is important to torque down the nuts at the back of the cover, but over-torquing the central bolt can(in my experience) pull out the stud from the engine itself. If the "back nuts" are properly torqued, you won't need the central nut anymore as it will not leak without it. But the bike does not look quite good with a large empty hole.
Check the torque of the covers after a week since the gaskets will compress.
No exact number given on the repair manual regarding the torques on the valve rocker covers. So I guess it's by feel. I'm guessing not exceeding 11Nm (oil pan torque value)
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Julio, you're awesome. Your precise desription is exactly what I was looking for. one thing I don't have is a torque wrench. hopefully they have one at the hobby shop. Is all liquid gasket the same? or do you recommend a brand?
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The small nuts are 10mm and should have spring washers -not split washers as these damage the metal surfaces. Use a short length spanner to tighten them up but leave the heavy-handed gorilla torque for the H-D's.
Same with the center stud acorn nut. So many peeps have stripped the threads in the aluminum head that it's no longer funny. You may even find a helicoil in yours. Just snug. And use a spring washer under the acorn nut, too.
The valve cover gasket is a thick item. Recommend the BMW OEM bits installed without gasket sealer. If you do use sealer, suggest you apply it on the valve cover side only.
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And to get those 10mm nuts and wave-washers from the small places, a small magnet-on-a-stick is one of the tools I pull out when I begin the project.
Be careful you don't drop them in your oil catch tray - which you will want under the cylinder head cover when you remove it. There will be (hopefully) a little bit of oil in the cover and it will go onto your floor if you are not prepared.
Yes, there are silicone gasket available for those troubled engines that will not seal well with OEM.
I've never used a gasket sealer here, but I have had to use TWO OEM gaskets sandwiched to stop a leak, which is usually pretty successful.
Real Gasket, silicone gasket supplier: http://www.realgaskets.com/files/motorcycle.htm
It used to be these were only available in red. They are now available in black.
I've never heard any bad reviews about them, not the valve cover gaskets, anyway.
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Thanks. Montmil. Do you have a link to the spring washers? Do they definitely need to be replaced? I would just need three of them for one side?
The valve cover gasket that I ordered is pretty thin. I'll take a picture of it and post it tomorrow. I keep hearing about the rubbers ones vs. the paper ones and it's kind of confusing.
What I've learned so far is that I need to tighten the nuts in the back, but don't tighten down the acorn too much.
When you say "you may find a helicoil", what's the other option? What if it's not a helicoil?
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I agree with Monty - no sealer. And go lightly on torquing those nuts.
To bond the gasket to the valve cover - spread some engine oil on the mating surface. The oil will 'glue' the gasket in place. Make sure the other mating surface is oil-free, otherwise it'll be a nightmare removing the valve covers next time!
While you're in there with the covers off, check the valve clearance.
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Agree with Monte on the stock gasket. Once they are stuck in place on one side they last almost for ever and don't leak.
I do it by feel rather than use a torque wrench on the 3 valve cover nuts because I don't have one that goes down remotely low enough and I doubt if many people have. You wouldn't be able to use one easily on the two 10mm nuts anyway. It's initially hard to believe how lightly they should be tightened up - not far past finger tight is enough and with wavy washers they won't come loose or the joint leak.
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Hey Sava66 -
For OEM part numbers, we have dealers that have online microfiche with detailed drawings of all parts of our bikes and the part numbers, which you can then give to your favorite dealer.
If you go to this link http://www.realoem.com/bmw/select.do and enter your bike's 7-digit serial # in the field provided, the program will take you directly to your production month.
BOOKMARK THIS PAGE, as it will always bring you to what is relevant to your bike.
Here in the U.S. we have a couple of mailorder dealers that have their own version of this software, and you can just select what you want & quantity and add it to your "shopping cart".
I'm sure you have something similar in Germany.
And I don't want to chase you away from here, by any means! But there is a German forum for R65's called KleineBoxer.de: http://www.kleineboxer.de/forum/index.php
You may find that to be a useful resource in finding local information.
And remember - many of these fasteners on these engines are steel fasteners going into alloy castings with threads cut into them. It is easy to damage the softer threads by over-tightening. Hence the earlier reference to a torque wrench.
The small, 10mm nuts on the back of the valve covers are NOT included in this warning. They are steel/steel.
Small wave washers are available at the local hardware store. No need to buy OEM for those.
Helicoils are a brand-name for a product that repairs damaged threads. Virtually invisible once installed.
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When putting the cover back on, remember that those things are Left/Right handed.
Julio is referring to the covers themselves.
They will fit on either side just fine, but if you happen to put them on the wrong sides, the horizontal "fins" will not be quite horizontal anymore. They will be angled upward in the front.
Play with it when you get your old ones off - you will see!
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I buy the metric wavy washers at either Lowe's or Home Depot here in CONUS. I would bet they are available in any German hardware store for less dinero than BME stock.
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something that looks like this? 10 mm?
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Yep. The wavy washer, or spring washers, are of a thin metal and will flatten when installed. Perhaps half the thickness of a conventional flat washer.
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thanks, while i was riding home today i was thinking how lucky i am for professionals like yourself to be answering my questions like "how do you use a wrench". i really am appreciative. today i was pulled up to the Motorrad Zentrum (BMW) right next to the base. I did admire those R1200GS, but in the end, when I rolled up, the whole place was pretty much staring at my bike. it wouldn't be that way with an R1200!
Below are pictures of the valve cover gasket. I'm hoping i only need one, not two.
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...today i was thinking how lucky i am for professionals like yourself to be answering my questions...
[smiley=ROTFLMAO.gif] Watch your mouth, hotrod. This is a family-oriented forum.
Below are pictures of the valve cover gasket. I'm hoping i only need one, not two.
Pictures? We don't see no stinkin' pictures. We love pictures.
Consider beginning to build up an in-house supply of frequently needed service parts, ie: valve cover gaskets (go ahead and buy two of 'em), oil filters, crush washers, wavy washers, oils and lubes, perhaps a clutch cable, spare bulbs... things that will be on hand when you need 'em. Ooh... I'm thinking this may lead to an entire new tread. Tires, Oil, and the dreaded Spare Parts. ::) Stash them in the kitchen pantry. Who needs food?
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perhaps a clutch cable
You want to be sure and put some axle grease on both ends of the clutch cable so it does not bind as it goes through it's travel.
The top one is especially vulnerable to this, as that barrel on the end of the cable has to be able to ROTATE as you pull the clutch lever, or else the wires in the cable will eventually break one at a time until...
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.pbase.com%2Ftomfarr%2Fimage%2F93825172%2Fmedium.jpg&hash=217c8fd48e2d252d432615022258ecda08898dc9) (http://www.pbase.com/tomfarr/image/93825172/large.jpg)
click for a larger picture
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so is this gasket adequate? is this a paper gasket? (in the pictures above?)
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The picture you posted, is the paper gasket that goes on the valve cover .
One gasket per valve cover .
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One of the customers at Siebenrock today (who happens to work in the same building as me) said "That's an R65? I think it's got an R100 engine!" I was shocked. Knowing so little about the history of the bike, I said, are you 100% sure? After a few seconds he changed his mind and said "no, it just looks like it because you have those valve covers on them". Are the valve covers I have on non-standard for a 1982?
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The R65 valve covers were bare metal from the factory, the R100 bikes had the valve covers painted, or powder coated black from the factory .
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After a few years in the fast lane, valve covers on any Airhead can begin to look a little gnarly.
Both my R65s came with a few minor scuffs plus a big chip outta one cover's fin. Not too pretty.
After a thorough cleaning, I applied a build up of JB Weld to the scuffed areas and, with the help of some masking tape, built up the nicked area on the one fin. Careful filing and sanding yielded a like-new surface texture.
Wanting to go faster than a stock R65, and more like an R100S, I painted them a semi-flat black. [smiley=thumbup.gif]
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Monte, so did you use the JB weld like bondo? Got any pics of the valve covers? What make/model of paint did you use? My goal now is to make the "BMW" letters on the engine shine again.
Why do other classic airheads have the model number on the engine (like R90) but it doesn't say R65 on my engine?
I am going to post some pictures soon on a new "detailing" topic. I think the answer to all of my (cosmetic) problems might be a dremel.
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I saw this new GS1200 in the BMW shop that had a blue/red gas tank paint scheme and one valve cover blue, one red. i thought it looked pretty cool.
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My dad had the same paint job done on his covers. After a year or so they started to bubble.
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My dad had the same paint job done on his covers. After a year or so they started to bubble.
Did he use high temperature paint?
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To answer your question - yes, the gaskets are paper, very thick paper. I've super glued broken ones and they sealed up fine. Doesn't hurt to try since it's no work to replace if it leaks.
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Did he use high temperature paint?
Actually, it started out as the original factory "magnesium" coating that came with the bike. Every Oilhead I have seen in this country with the coloured valve covers(1150 Rockster and GS Adventure) is suffering the same problem. And I mean Every one of those models. I have yet to see an oilhead coloured valve covers without a blemish on its finish.
Other people(like my dad) then removed the color by sandpaper then had a layer of powdercoated on. He was not the only one who did this and still, the covers slowly flaked off.
It must be the humidity here or something.
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Monte, so did you use the JB weld like bondo? Yes Got any pics of the valve covers? Looking for 'em What make/model of paint did you use? Ace Hardware-brand semi-gloss black. Been on for a few years now. My goal now is to make the "BMW" letters on the engine shine again. They never were shiny. Brushed aluminum, they are.
Why do other classic airheads have the model number on the engine (like R90) but it doesn't say R65 on my engine? BMW's decision. The side panels often had stickers that read "R65". Many of the slash series bikes had the i'd' plates as stick-on attachment.
I am going to post some pictures soon on a new "detailing" topic. I think the answer to all of my (cosmetic) problems might be a dremel.
This is a "tuned up" valve cover on the '83 Mexico Bike with the Ace Hardware & BMW Parts paint. In reviewing your valve cover damage, it may be a better idea to source a used one off eBay.
(https://bmwr65.org/smf/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi196.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Faa1%2Fmontmil%2FBMW%2520R65%2FR65Wrap03.jpg&hash=05b14511337e1d308bc307b3734019ae8fbd9a5a)
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I got a pair of valve covers for 15 euro from ebay.de. I just wanted to know about the paint you used. I just need a feeler gauge and an oil catch and I'll be ready. i have everything else I need. It looks like you have some carbon fiber on your pipes too. gold? looks cool.
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Definitely not carbon fiber. Exhaust header wrap from JEGS:
http://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS+Performance+Products/555/32062/10002/-1